Inspector question on upgraded panel

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hotblueelectric

hotblueelectric

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Dallas Texas
I installed a new panel in an older home 1970's and the inspector red tagged us because he said that the 2003 NEC states that the rest of the home needs to be brought up to code, Smokes and GFCI's. Is this true I dont even have a 2003 NEC. Have done many panel upgrades and this is the first time I've heard this. Thanks for advise.
 
hotblueelectric said:
I installed a new panel in an older home 1970's and the inspector red tagged us because he said that the 2003 NEC states that the rest of the home needs to be brought up to code, Smokes and GFCI's. Is this true I dont even have a 2003 NEC. Have done many panel upgrades and this is the first time I've heard this. Thanks for advise.
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Ask him to show it to you. It ain't there.
 
To start with, there is no "2003 NEC." It was published in 2002, and again in 2005, but not in 2003. I don't know if Texas adopts its own version of the code (born and raised there, but never worked as an engineer there). Could he be citing something along the lines of "the 2003 Texas Electrical Code, based on the 2002 NEC"?

The 2005 NEC moved the so-called "grandfather clause" to the back of the book. Take a look at 80.9(C). Although that article, being now in the "annex," is not enforceable, it tells me that you only have to bring up to modern codes the things that you actually modify.
 
I agree with the others and I also agree that it may be a local or state ordinance.

Don't beat up on him to bad just because he quoted the wrong source. Here the 2005 NEC is the 2007 CEC. We also do not enforce ADA, we enforce the California Building Code.

Here, I may tell someone that an energy requirement is per Title 24, while true it is not necessarily accurate. Title 24 has twelve parts and is the official triennial compilation and publication of the adoptions, ammendments and repeal of administrative regulations to California Code of Regulations, Title 24 (the NEC is Title 24 Part 3, Energy is Title 24 Part 6, etc) also referred to as the California Building Standards Code.

That all said, he could just be full of it too.:grin:
 
Cavie said:
Ask him to show it to you. It ain't there.
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How would you know, most people have never seen a 2003 code book because this inspector has the only copy? :grin:

Just joking, there is probably a communications problem here somewhere. I'm guessing a local code that they started to enforce since 2003.

I don't know why everyone wants to get bent out of shape over these small problems. When an inspector makes a ruling that you don't agree with the first place to go is right to his boss and see if you can get a satisfactory answer from him. This guy may be new on the job and may not know very much. It's happened before.
 
cowboyjwc said:
Here the 2005 NEC is the 2007 CEC.
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I knew that, since a copy of the 2007 California Electrical Code is sitting 10 feet away from my desk. That is why I asked whether Texas has a similar situation. Here, the state has adopted the 2008 NEC, with specific changes that are published as "Washington Admin Code." I also have a copy, at my desk, of the "Seattle Electrical Code," which is a set of substitute pages that can be inserted into a 3-ring binder version of the NEC, if you have one.
 
I can't speak for the Texas electrical code and I don't know of anything requiring the gfci upgrade, but the unmodified IRC which may very well apply there states
When alterations, repairs or additions requiring a permit occur, or when one or more sleeping rooms are added or created in existing dwellings, the individual dwelling unit shall be equipped with smoke alarms located as required for new dwellings; the smoke alarms shall be interconnected and hard wired
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There is then an exception which allows non-interconnected battery only smoke detectors in locations where there is no attic access and interconnection and hard wiring would require removal of wall or ceiling finishes
 
charlie b said:
I knew that, since a copy of the 2007 California Electrical Code is sitting 10 feet away from my desk. That is why I asked whether Texas has a similar situation. Here, the state has adopted the 2008 NEC, with specific changes that are published as "Washington Admin Code." I also have a copy, at my desk, of the "Seattle Electrical Code," which is a set of substitute pages that can be inserted into a 3-ring binder version of the NEC, if you have one.
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I knew I liked you.:D

The 2008 NEC will most likely become the 2010 CEC. We used to just get different colored pages to insert, but now NFPA actually just publishes a book with the changes in it.

Our local amendments are printed in a seperate book, but the electrical portion doesn't really amend anything it simply limits your options on certain things.
 
Heck, sounds like anything goes in Texas. The HI's have to report that a house regardless of age and Code cycle built under is defective if it does not have AFCIs.
 
many times in Tampa when my company does a service up grade the first thing the inspector looks for if we up graded the range wire and dryer to 4 wire circuit,I was told if you dint move the panel from the present location you dint have to up grade the circuits the same is said on the smokes arc fault GFI and every thing eles that needs to be then up graded if you change the panel.
PS.Our company does all this up to coed changes when we do the house and they charge for all up grades.my Question is it Mandatory so when I do side work.
 
hotblueelectric said:
I installed a new panel in an older home 1970's and the inspector red tagged us because he said that the 2003 NEC states that the rest of the home needs to be brought up to code, Smokes and GFCI's. Is this true I dont even have a 2003 NEC. Have done many panel upgrades and this is the first time I've heard this. Thanks for advise.
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Perhaps call an established EC in the area and see if he has run into this.

It does not seem right if you have a problem with the panel you have to upgrade the house.

Our stimulus plan at work?
 
Inspector on upgraded panel

Inspector on upgraded panel

I talked to the inspector again and he is getting this information from the 2003 International Residential Code. Never heard of this book before. Anyone else? Thanks guys appreciate the feedback.
 
hotblueelectric said:
I installed a new panel in an older home 1970's and the inspector red tagged us because he said that the 2003 NEC states that the rest of the home needs to be brought up to code, Smokes and GFCI's. Is this true I dont even have a 2003 NEC. Have done many panel upgrades and this is the first time I've heard this. Thanks for advise.
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The 2003 IRC does not state that a service upgrade requires the house to be brought up to the current codes or GFCIs either. There is wording that may require the smoke alarms to be brought up to code though.
 
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