insulated grounding conductor in hottub installation

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liquidtite said:
the ocp is a 50I 2pole in the mdp.#6awg is feeding the outside subpanel witch has a 30I 2polegfi and a 2pole gfi 20I the subpanel acts as the disconect and the ocp the 30I is for the motor i forgot what the 20 amp is for
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That makes the 6AWG portion a feeder. The branch circuit(s) is after the final overcurrent device.
 
iwire said:
I would love to see a packaged hot tub that requires a 50 amp circuit and does not have any additional OCP in it.
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Bob, I don't have time to look it up right now since I'm already late to an appointment but there is an exception that allows any chapter 3 wiring method with an insulated or covered EGC to supply a packaged hot tub. Since the OP is supplying a panel that is not part of the hot tub this exception would not apply and NM cable would not be permitted.
 
iwire said:
I would love to see a packaged hot tub that requires a 50 amp circuit and does not have any additional OCP in it.
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I think he was saying that the disconnect does not need OCPD. The GFCI can be in the main panel. I often just put in an unfused pullout with a 50 amp GFCI in the panel.
 
K8MHZ said:
Hmm......

What about the conductors to a power strip with a circuit breaker in it? Are they feeders, too?
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That is not an NEC application. I agree with the fact that the wire to a furnace is a feeder if there is a fuse at the disconnect. Unless it is considered a supplemental OCPD then the branch circuit goes from the fuse to the furnace. The other part is the feeder.

I tried to get this changed but I somehow I wrote the proposal and never sent it in.:dunce:
 
iwire said:
I would love to see a packaged hot tub that requires a 50 amp circuit and does not have any additional OCP in it.
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I know I have hooked up hot tubs that needed a single 50 amp circuit before. There may have been additional fuses within the control unit, but as far as NEC goes this unit is fed with a 50 amp branch circuit and not a 50 amp feeder.
 
curt swartz said:
Bob, I don't have time to look it up right now since I'm already late to an appointment but there is an exception that allows any chapter 3 wiring method with an insulated or covered EGC to supply a packaged hot tub.
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That exception applies to branch circuits, it is not as clear to me as the others that a 50 amp circuit to a hot tub with built in OCPDs is a branch circuit.
 
iwire said:
And that is the point that we disagree.
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ART 100 definitions (2008 NEC):

Branch Circuit. The circuit conductors between the final overcurrent device protecting the circuit and the outlet(s).


Feeder. All circuit conductors between the service equipment, the source of a separately derived system, or other power supply source and the final branch-circuit overcurrent device.

Outlet. A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment.


Not saying you are necessarily wrong but where is the outlet(s) located for a 50 amp single supply hot tub? If there is fuses in the control panel for the tub is outlet(s) somewhere within the unit or is the outlet(s) where field wiring ends?

From the way I read it the branch circuit is between wherever the outlet(s) is located and the last overcurrent device ahead of it.
 
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