hardworkingstiff
Senior Member
- Location
- Wilmington, NC
I think you need a rod, reel, cooler of beer, and a friend to go fishing. The friend is the most important part.
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year?
- Thread starter jaylectricity
- Start date
- Status
jaylectricity
Senior Member
- Location
- Massachusetts
- Occupation
- licensed journeyman electrician
Wow guys...thank you for the responses. It's too late to respond to each post I'd like to so I'll talk to you tomorrow. I have a few more questions and I'd like to help others learn from my mistakes as well.
Just know that I appreciate the candor you all have shown.
Just know that I appreciate the candor you all have shown.
bjp_ne_elec
Senior Member
- Location
- Southern NH
Jay - first you have to decide if you want to stick it out in the electrical trade. I think Pierre's post covers things you ought to think out. If you decide that's the career you want, then I'd recommend getting hired by an EC and getting your experience so you can get your Masters license - and to do this, you need to log the experience.
Then, on the business end, you have to decide if you want to be your own boss. Obviously, you'd need to take your Masters to go this route. In any business, you're going to have your ups and downs - but you have to take each and draw experience from it. If you take care of the customers and do good quality work, I don't think you'll have a problem. Focus on building a customer base - keeping any customer pleased so that they'll come back. A pleased customer is also your best advertising - and it only costs you good quality work.
Most small contractors I know do very little advertising, and depend mostly on work of mouth. You can also drop your business cards at local businesses. I got my first good size job, due to the fact my son's girlfriend dropped a pile off at a local pizza shop. I didn't even know she had done it. That job turned in to four more - again, just by word of mouth.
What path you do decide, you have to put your heart and sole in to it. If it's not this business, it doesn't matter - just pour everything you have in to it - and it will work out.
Hope this helps.
Then, on the business end, you have to decide if you want to be your own boss. Obviously, you'd need to take your Masters to go this route. In any business, you're going to have your ups and downs - but you have to take each and draw experience from it. If you take care of the customers and do good quality work, I don't think you'll have a problem. Focus on building a customer base - keeping any customer pleased so that they'll come back. A pleased customer is also your best advertising - and it only costs you good quality work.
Most small contractors I know do very little advertising, and depend mostly on work of mouth. You can also drop your business cards at local businesses. I got my first good size job, due to the fact my son's girlfriend dropped a pile off at a local pizza shop. I didn't even know she had done it. That job turned in to four more - again, just by word of mouth.
What path you do decide, you have to put your heart and sole in to it. If it's not this business, it doesn't matter - just pour everything you have in to it - and it will work out.
Hope this helps.
Brady Electric
Senior Member
- Location
- Asheville, N. C.
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
After getting out of the Marines in 1974 after serving 6 years on active duty and a tour in Nam I had 13 W-2's in one year. I stuck with electrical and do not regret it. I have had good times and bad but everyone does no matter what occupation you have. I suggest you stay in business and move slowly. Get your bills where you can manage and don't spend what you don't have. I have been in debt and learned to only buy what you can afford. I run a cash only business and my life is good. I have built my business on good service, trust, honesty, and reasonable prices. All my customers have become my friends (by that I mean I could socialize with them and I put them in my phone index), which I have about 250 customers. People like it when they call and you know its them even if its been over a year. I also treat everyone like I want to be treated. When I go over a job I give all customers my thoughts on how to wire the job according to the NEC and on extras, then let them decide. Even if you stay small like I do you will make more money than working for someone else. You will always have work no matter what the economy is. You must know how to do all phases of electrical work and be able to do anything that comes up. If I have any questions I call my Electrical Inspectors and they will tell you. I have built good re-pore with all of them and they trust me. I always do what I say and most of all do quality work and return all calls and let people know when you are going to be late. I have found everyone will wait on you if you do this and let them know. Personality, good service and honesty sells. Just think only one service change in most cases will give you a good pay week in one day compared to what most companies will pay. Its hard to put into words how I feel and I am not the best typist, but I hope this helps. Most everyone in this forum are seasoned electricians and care about helping others. You can learn allot about electrical by going to Mike Holt's web site. Semper Fi
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
After getting out of the Marines in 1974 after serving 6 years on active duty and a tour in Nam I had 13 W-2's in one year. I stuck with electrical and do not regret it. I have had good times and bad but everyone does no matter what occupation you have. I suggest you stay in business and move slowly. Get your bills where you can manage and don't spend what you don't have. I have been in debt and learned to only buy what you can afford. I run a cash only business and my life is good. I have built my business on good service, trust, honesty, and reasonable prices. All my customers have become my friends (by that I mean I could socialize with them and I put them in my phone index), which I have about 250 customers. People like it when they call and you know its them even if its been over a year. I also treat everyone like I want to be treated. When I go over a job I give all customers my thoughts on how to wire the job according to the NEC and on extras, then let them decide. Even if you stay small like I do you will make more money than working for someone else. You will always have work no matter what the economy is. You must know how to do all phases of electrical work and be able to do anything that comes up. If I have any questions I call my Electrical Inspectors and they will tell you. I have built good re-pore with all of them and they trust me. I always do what I say and most of all do quality work and return all calls and let people know when you are going to be late. I have found everyone will wait on you if you do this and let them know. Personality, good service and honesty sells. Just think only one service change in most cases will give you a good pay week in one day compared to what most companies will pay. Its hard to put into words how I feel and I am not the best typist, but I hope this helps. Most everyone in this forum are seasoned electricians and care about helping others. You can learn allot about electrical by going to Mike Holt's web site. Semper Fi
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
Interesting that no one in the licensing bureau picked up that all your experience you used to get your license didn't count.
petersonra said:
The law is that 2 Journeyman can't work together if 1 doesn't hold their Master's. That was the illegal part. He said that he got his ticket and didn't abandon ship on his former boss when he got his Journeyman's. Illegal--yes, but stand up considering the size of shop and the job going on.
Jay what part of Ma are you in?
Tom
- Location
- Simi Valley, CA
Well, like many of the others I can't offer you much more than a little advice.
I'm one of the lucky ones, I'll be 49 in a month and I haven't been out of work since I was 14 years old and any move I've made has always been up. Now I do get bored and think that there might be more money out there somewhere, but then I look at what I have and what I can live on and still be happy. No I can't just go out and buy a boat or anything like that on a whim, but I have a wife who loves me a great son and daughter and two beautiful grandchildren, a nice house that has enough room so that my mother-in-law can live with us and be taken care of and my dad just moved to town so that he's closer and I can look after him if I have too. We've all got our health and I have many good friends and we really like the community we live in.
Like someone said the grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence, in fact it's probably the same grass that just grew under the fence.
If the fact is that you can't keep your business running then you really do have to look at working for some one and I'm not knocking you, but anyone who thinks that $25 dollars an hour is not enough money should remember that it's about $20 more than minimum wage. (Please no debates)
You might have to be a little picky about where you look if you want health benifits and such. Maybe look at going into facility maintenance work at a big plant. The pays usually not to bad and the benies are good and the hours are usually pretty regular. Or you could just chase the boom towns and follow the work if you're able.
Good luck to you and I do wish you the best.
I'm one of the lucky ones, I'll be 49 in a month and I haven't been out of work since I was 14 years old and any move I've made has always been up. Now I do get bored and think that there might be more money out there somewhere, but then I look at what I have and what I can live on and still be happy. No I can't just go out and buy a boat or anything like that on a whim, but I have a wife who loves me a great son and daughter and two beautiful grandchildren, a nice house that has enough room so that my mother-in-law can live with us and be taken care of and my dad just moved to town so that he's closer and I can look after him if I have too. We've all got our health and I have many good friends and we really like the community we live in.
Like someone said the grass isn't greener on the other side of the fence, in fact it's probably the same grass that just grew under the fence.
If the fact is that you can't keep your business running then you really do have to look at working for some one and I'm not knocking you, but anyone who thinks that $25 dollars an hour is not enough money should remember that it's about $20 more than minimum wage. (Please no debates)
You might have to be a little picky about where you look if you want health benifits and such. Maybe look at going into facility maintenance work at a big plant. The pays usually not to bad and the benies are good and the hours are usually pretty regular. Or you could just chase the boom towns and follow the work if you're able.
Good luck to you and I do wish you the best.
boboelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- Eighty Four,Pa.15330
Nothing hurt me worst than 9/11,when the world took a deep pause. Luckily, I heeded a sucessful bridge builder,who told me to put away cash for the off times.
Brady Electric
Senior Member
- Location
- Asheville, N. C.
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
CowboyJWC that was good. I got a private e-mail from him where he didn't understand that you could make in a day by doing one service change what most people make in a week around here. I apologize to everyone for that advice because I didn't take in consideration that it depends on where you live and what your life style is and whether or not your wife works. It all up to every individual as to what it takes to live and after you figure it out you can get own with your life. I gross about $132,000.00 a year and get buy pretty good, but I also live in N.C. and that makes a big difference. From now own I think I will keep my advice to a minimum. Been in bussiness for 35 years and happy. Semper Fi
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
CowboyJWC that was good. I got a private e-mail from him where he didn't understand that you could make in a day by doing one service change what most people make in a week around here. I apologize to everyone for that advice because I didn't take in consideration that it depends on where you live and what your life style is and whether or not your wife works. It all up to every individual as to what it takes to live and after you figure it out you can get own with your life. I gross about $132,000.00 a year and get buy pretty good, but I also live in N.C. and that makes a big difference. From now own I think I will keep my advice to a minimum. Been in bussiness for 35 years and happy. Semper Fi
- Location
- Simi Valley, CA
Brady, You're not necessarly wrong, if you did one service change a day, 5 days a week, 52 weeks a year, at the going rate around here that would be $416,000 a year (less material), not a bad living.
Between my wife and I we make about what you do, and here in SoCal that's not very much, but I never thought I would make that much and never thought I would live in a $600,000 home and own both my cars outright.
I remember the year I made $10,000 and thought to my self, man if I could just get to $15,000 I'd be set, how much more money could I need. Now there are days that I reach into my pocket and pull out a $5 bill and think, Crap, I still owe someone $5.
It just becomes a matter of what you want in life. I gave up the overtime so that I could volunteer with the local Little League, I became a coach and then league president, my wife stepped up and came on the board, as did our daughter. On any given week we spend at least 20+ hours doing some sort of Little League work and I would not trade the time I have spent watching my son and granddaughter play baseball for anything. We again have to postpone our vacation until at least August as my son has made the All-Star team again, and I would much rather say that than it's postponed because I have to work.
It's all about choices. If it's all about the money, put in your 60-70 hours a week, promise your wife (if you still have one) that you'll take that cruise someday, tell your son or daughter that you'll make their next school play or ball game or fill in the blank.
Remember, nobody on their death bed ever said, I wish I had spent more time in the office.
Between my wife and I we make about what you do, and here in SoCal that's not very much, but I never thought I would make that much and never thought I would live in a $600,000 home and own both my cars outright.
I remember the year I made $10,000 and thought to my self, man if I could just get to $15,000 I'd be set, how much more money could I need. Now there are days that I reach into my pocket and pull out a $5 bill and think, Crap, I still owe someone $5.
It just becomes a matter of what you want in life. I gave up the overtime so that I could volunteer with the local Little League, I became a coach and then league president, my wife stepped up and came on the board, as did our daughter. On any given week we spend at least 20+ hours doing some sort of Little League work and I would not trade the time I have spent watching my son and granddaughter play baseball for anything. We again have to postpone our vacation until at least August as my son has made the All-Star team again, and I would much rather say that than it's postponed because I have to work.
It's all about choices. If it's all about the money, put in your 60-70 hours a week, promise your wife (if you still have one) that you'll take that cruise someday, tell your son or daughter that you'll make their next school play or ball game or fill in the blank.
Remember, nobody on their death bed ever said, I wish I had spent more time in the office.
jaylectricity
Senior Member
- Location
- Massachusetts
- Occupation
- licensed journeyman electrician
e57 said:
Yeah, I live in a smaller town in nice clean one bedroom apartment for $750 a month, I don't have a wife or kids so if things are tight I only have to sacrifice myself.
And staying positive used to be my mantra. I picked up so many friends when they were down by helping them look at things in a positive light. I guess that's what I need to get back here, something you guys are all helping me see.
Davis9 said:
I'm on the South Shore and thanks for clarifying that to petersonra.
quogueelectric said:
Yeah I'm a firm believer in telling the truth at all costs. It simplifies life when you don't have to keep up a dramatic infrastructure on life's situations. But I've gotten better at recognizing dishonesty as I see it.
Thanks for all of your advice!
jaylectricity
Senior Member
- Location
- Massachusetts
- Occupation
- licensed journeyman electrician
Pierre C Belarge said:What you need to try and do is collect your thoughts in as much of an orderly manner as is possible.
What do I like to do?
What are my obligations and responsibilities?
How do I get around to fulfiling those as soon as I can, so I can think more clearly?
How long will it take to clean up those responsiblities?
Do not be afraid to speak to those you are responsible to and tell them you have every intention to fulfill your obligations.
--
I can tell you that a lot more people are going through what you are experiencing then you may believe...most get through it in time, some never do, it all depends on how hard you are willing to work to get there.
Always work with your mind thinking positively - PMA - positive mental attitude...it may take you some time to develop such a habit, but once you do, you will never loose it.
--
I hope you get the sense that maybe I myself have been down your path
Good Luck and keep your chin up!!
Thank you Pierre...lots of good reading in there.
And thanks to anyone I didn't thank personally, sorry about that.
Brady Electric
Senior Member
- Location
- Asheville, N. C.
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
There has been allot of different advice for this thread. It has taught me that all of us live in different situation's and live under different rules and regulations. I always thought that the NEC was the National Electrical Code and every electrician ran there business under it, boy was I wrong. I also have learned what a wise man once said, (you become whom ever you hang around) such as a hard working, honest, and knowledgeable person. Thanks to all of you for your input on all phases on this forum. Have a GREAT Fourth of July and Semper Fi.
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
There has been allot of different advice for this thread. It has taught me that all of us live in different situation's and live under different rules and regulations. I always thought that the NEC was the National Electrical Code and every electrician ran there business under it, boy was I wrong. I also have learned what a wise man once said, (you become whom ever you hang around) such as a hard working, honest, and knowledgeable person. Thanks to all of you for your input on all phases on this forum. Have a GREAT Fourth of July and Semper Fi.
jaylectricity
Senior Member
- Location
- Massachusetts
- Occupation
- licensed journeyman electrician
Brady Electric said:
Thanks for the holiday wishes! And yes, this forum never fails to amaze me. You can't agree with everybody but there have been many times that I saw a few totally different viewpoints and I had to challenge myself to try to dispute each viewpoint.
Most of the time there is more than one way to get things accomplished. I know that sometimes fellow electricians have interests that are in conflict with each other. Mostly that is healthy competition but sometimes we have to find ways to co-exist. And we do.
If the decisions I face and achieve are electricity related, I will keep you posted.
Thank you so much.
Jay
Brady Electric
Senior Member
- Location
- Asheville, N. C.
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
Wish you good luck on your decision's in business and everyday life. I feel like this forum broadens my knowledge, teaches and makes me chuckle from time to time. I also feel I have made new friends across the United States. I feel like I know the regulars on this forum personally. I believe after all is said and done anyone on this forum will do anything to help someone. Semper Fi
Is it possible to be at a crossroads for more than a year
Wish you good luck on your decision's in business and everyday life. I feel like this forum broadens my knowledge, teaches and makes me chuckle from time to time. I also feel I have made new friends across the United States. I feel like I know the regulars on this forum personally. I believe after all is said and done anyone on this forum will do anything to help someone. Semper Fi
jrannis
Senior Member
- Location
- Fort Lauderdale/ Miami
Working Poor
Working Poor
I read with some concern that the guy you were working for didn't have a Masters License and it seems that you are contracting using a Journeyman's license. I believe you are causing your own problems by working in Grey areas at best. You cant usually operate without a good solid 10 years of experience and expect positive results.
My advise to you would be to find a large to medium sized contractor that can teach you some basic sales and project management.
You seem to be able to articulate your thoughts well, this is your advantage. Good communication skills are becoming scarce. A background in the restaurant business most likely provided you with good people skills both with employees and customers. Do not take this skill for granted!!
Working Poor
I read with some concern that the guy you were working for didn't have a Masters License and it seems that you are contracting using a Journeyman's license. I believe you are causing your own problems by working in Grey areas at best. You cant usually operate without a good solid 10 years of experience and expect positive results.
My advise to you would be to find a large to medium sized contractor that can teach you some basic sales and project management.
You seem to be able to articulate your thoughts well, this is your advantage. Good communication skills are becoming scarce. A background in the restaurant business most likely provided you with good people skills both with employees and customers. Do not take this skill for granted!!
jaylectricity
Senior Member
- Location
- Massachusetts
- Occupation
- licensed journeyman electrician
jrannis said:
My old boss admits that he is not a good business man so I didn't learn a whole lot from him on that end. I have no idea how he lands the jobs he does.
I'm currently looking into getting more experience with a larger contractor, hopefully one that won't mind teaching me how to open my own shop correctly. I'm not sure why a contractor would want to teach me how to become his competitor, but I do hope for a friendly trustworthy relationship that is mutually beneficial. I am willing to do whatever it takes to help his business grow while he is paying me.
Thank you for the compliments on my communication skills...
This is coming from someone who's tried to start small businesses in the past. It's really hard to do. Advertising is a waste of money for the most part. If you have your business name in the yellow pages that's good enough. Gives you some legitamency. How I see successful electical businesses spring up is that a employee starts doing so much side work that he decides to start his own business. If you can make it on just your side work and the phone is ringing off the hook then you're probably ok leaving your comapany. If you have all the licenses and permits you can even be doing it legaly while working for someone else.
quogueelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- new york
best advice yet
best advice yet
best advice yet
This guy hit it right on the head for you. Work for someone else and be a weekend warrior legit and try not to steal your bosses material or his customers because you will find that is the most irritating thing when someone does it to you. Remember the golden rule. He who has the gold rules. Oh sorry I meant do unto others as you would have others do unto you. There is enough money in this buisness where noone has to steal.wireman71 said:
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