Is this a wet location?

[Isaiah]

If PVC conduit is installed under a concrete building slab with visqueen is this considered to be a wet location ?


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[LarryFine]

Yeah, in the dirt is pretty much always a wet location.

 

[Isaiah]

Yeah, in the dirt is pretty much always a wet location.

Even though the slab has visqueen?


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[LarryFine]

I had to look it up.

Yes, because the water comes from condensation, not (necessarily) leakage.

 

[Isaiah]

I had to look it up.

Yes, because the water comes from condensation, not (necessarily) leakage.

And…The condensate overtime could potentially fill up the conduit completely with water.


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[Eddie702]

anything below grade is a wet location

 

[wwhitney]

Even though the slab has visqueen?

Is the conduit between the visqueen and the top of slab, or below the visqueen?

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Isaiah]

Is the conduit between the visqueen and the top of slab, or below the visqueen?

Cheers, Wayne

It’s below the visqueen


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[Dennis Alwon]

Is the conduit between the visqueen and the top of slab, or below the visqueen?

Cheers, Wayne

Why would that matter?

I don't see anything in 300.5(B) that would suggest otherwise.

 

[wwhitney]

Why would that matter? I don't see anything in 300.5(B) that would suggest otherwise.

Well, "underground" is not a defined term. And looking at the definition of wet location, if the conduit was above the visqueen and actually in the slab, you could argue that it's not a wet location: "Location, Wet: Installations underground or in concrete slabs or masonry in direct contact with the earth; . . ."

I haven't parsed out all the possibilities, but it sounds like it's moot for the OP.

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Isaiah]

Well, "underground" is not a defined term. And looking at the definition of wet location, if the conduit was above the visqueen and actually in the slab, you could argue that it's not a wet location: "Location, Wet: Installations underground or in concrete slabs or masonry in direct contact with the earth; . . ."

I haven't parsed out all the possibilities, but it sounds like it's moot for the OP.

Cheers, Wayne

Nice observation


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[Dennis Alwon]

Well, "underground" is not a defined term. And looking at the definition of wet location, if the conduit was above the visqueen and actually in the slab, you could argue that it's not a wet location: "Location, Wet: Installations underground or in concrete slabs or masonry in direct contact with the earth; . . ."

I haven't parsed out all the possibilities, but it sounds like it's moot for the OP.

Cheers, Wayne

So you are not giving the thought that condensation will be an issue. Can I argue that a vertical run of conduit on the exterior of a building will not get wet inside. Think of PVC glued. It can rain all day but the conduit will not be wet inside from the rain yet the wiring must be wet location rated.

 

[wwhitney]

So you are not giving the thought

I'm not really giving the issue any thought at all, I'm just reading the definition.

If the idea were that any conduit in any slab on grade were in a wet location, the definition obviously would have said "Location, Wet: Installations underground or in concrete slabs or masonry supported by earth. . . ." But it doesn't say that. The implication is that some slabs on grade are not wet locations. The distinction is whether the slab is in "direct contact with earth."

Cheers, Wayne

 

[Isaiah]

I'm not really giving the issue any thought at all, I'm just reading the definition.

If the idea were that any conduit in any slab on grade were in a wet location, the definition obviously would have said "Location, Wet: Installations underground or in concrete slabs or masonry supported by earth. . . ." But it doesn't say that. The implication is that some slabs on grade are not wet locations. The distinction is whether the slab is in "direct contact with earth."

Cheers, Wayne

Wayne
Assuming the u/g conduit/cable is constantly immersed in water (due to condensate, seepage or whatever) what would be the impact to the jacket if the cable is NOT rated for wet locations? Would the jacket slowly disintegrate, crack, crumble? Any thoughts?


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[Dennis Alwon]

Wayne
Assuming the u/g conduit/cable is constantly immersed in water (due to condensate, seepage or whatever) what would be the impact to the jacket if the cable is NOT rated for wet locations? Would the jacket slowly disintegrate, crack, crumble? Any thoughts?


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I hate to say this but I have see nm cable underground for 25 years or more and it was still working..... No conduit at all.

 

[Isaiah]

I hate to say this but I have see nm cable underground for 25 years or more and it was still working..... No conduit at all.

Yep, and I’ve seen similar as well


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[Dennis Alwon]

Yep, and I’ve seen similar as well


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I just want to say I am not condoning it or saying to do it. I like staying within code.

 

[Isaiah]

I just want to say I am not condoning it or saying to do it. I like staying within code.

Understood - thanks


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