Jacuzzi tub

[Duneit]

Hello all. I have an inspector who is calling me on a jacuzzi tub in a bathroom to have the hot and cold water bonded with same ground wire that's grounding the motor. There's about a foot of copper after the plastic plumbing pipe its connected to. Anyone heard of such a thing? He also made me remove the plug in gfci's from the access hole, install regular receptacles, and then install faceless gfci's outside the access door. In my 40+ years I've never encountered this. Any help is appreciated

 

[infinity]

The GFCI has to be readily accessible so he's correct about that. Here's the applicable bonding section.

680.74(A) General.
The following parts shall be bonded together:
(1) All metal fittings within or attached to the tub structure that are in contact with the circulating water
(2) Metal parts of electrical equipment associated with the tub water circulating system, including pump and blower motors
(3) Metal-sheathed cables, metal raceways, and metal piping within 1.5 m (5 ft) of the inside walls of the tub and not separated from the tub by a permanent barrier
(4)All exposed metal surfaces that are within 1.5 m (5 ft) of the inside walls of the tub and not separated from the tub area by a permanent barrier
(5)Non–current-carrying metal parts of electrical devices and controls that are not associated with the hydromassage tubs within 1.5 m (5 ft) from such units
Exception No. 1: Small conductive surfaces not likely to become energized, such as air and water jets, supply valve assemblies, and drain fittings not connected to metallic piping, and towel bars, mirror frames,
and similar nonelectrical equipment not connected to metal framing shall not be required to be bonded. Exception No. 2: Double-insulated motors and blowers shall not be bonded.

680.74(B) All metal parts required to be bonded by this section shall be bonded together using a solid copper bonding jumper, insulated, covered, or bare, not smaller than 8 AWG. The bonding jumper(s) shall be required for equipotential bonding in the area of the hydromassage bathtub and shall not be required to be extended or attached to any remote panelboard, service equipment, or any electrode. In all installations a bonding jumper long enough to terminate on a replacement non-double-insulated pump or blower motor shall be provided and shall be terminated to the equipment grounding conductor of the branch circuit of the motor when a double-insulated circulating pump or blower motor is used.

 

[Duneit]

Thanks for the clarification. I don't understand why opening the access door and having the plugs right there in front of you isn't sufficient

 

[Duneit]

Same inspector is using a $30 Klein afci/gfci tester and says 50 of the 100 brand new breakers are bad and wants me to prove they are functioning properly

 

[tom baker]

Thanks for the clarification. I don't understand why opening the access door and having the plugs right there in front of you isn't sufficient

Please read the definition of readily accessible

 

[infinity]

Same inspector is using a $30 Klein afci/gfci tester and says 50 of the 100 brand new breakers are bad and wants me to prove they are functioning properly

Depressing the TEST button is the only test that's required.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Hello all. I have an inspector who is calling me on a jacuzzi tub in a bathroom to have the hot and cold water bonded with same ground wire that's grounding the motor. There's about a foot of copper after the plastic plumbing pipe its connected to. Anyone heard of such a thing? He also made me remove the plug in gfci's from the access hole, install regular receptacles, and then install faceless gfci's outside the access door. In my 40+ years I've never encountered this. Any help is appreciated

That is the way we always wired hydromassage tubs. I would install the faceless gfci switch above the switches for the bathroom by the door and use a standard receptacle under the tub area.

The reason we did it was to make access to the gfci function easier than trying to get down on the floor and get to the reset.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Bonding the water lines is, imo ridiculous in your situation. I have seen some manufacturers require a #8 back to the panel and connected to the pump lug on the outside of the motor. This isn't even required for swimming pools but for some reason these manufacturers think that it is a good idea....

True Confessions
I have never installed a #8 back to the panel.

 

[LarryFine]

Thanks for the clarification. I don't understand why opening the access door and having the plugs right there in front of you isn't sufficient

Same reason a kitchen GFCI can't be under the sink.

 

[jimport]

Some tubs do not allow access below the tub due to tile and stone finishes.

 

[Duneit]

Thanks everyone. I appreciate the professional feedback with codes backing up answers

 

[infinity]

Thanks everyone. I appreciate the professional feedback with codes backing up answers

You're welcome. Your inspector should provide you with the code sections that he thinks you've violated.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Some tubs do not allow access below the tub due to tile and stone finishes.

The nec requires access it is the contractor who isn't providing the access. We have installed a tile panel for a hydromassae tub and you couldn't see the seam unless you looked carefully. We have also cut out the plywood under the tub in the section where the motor was accessible from a crawl space or we have also moved the pumps into the crawl area below the tub. Obviously not always possible.

 

[tom baker]

Depressing the TEST button is the only test that's required.

If the gfci does not trip with a plug in tester, almost always that means there is no EGC. Show AHJ mfg instructions

 

[Duneit]

If the gfci does not trip with a plug in tester, almost always that means there is no EGC. Show AHJ mfg instructions

AFCI not gfci not tripping

 

[tom baker]

What code cycle? Bathrooms 2020 are earlier bathrooms not required to be AFCI. Not sure about 2023 don’t have that book yet.

 

[letgomywago]

AFCI not gfci not tripping

Breaker instructions will show you test with test button on breaker for the afci also. Klien has decided they can test afci but it is not the test used by UL.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

If the gfci does not trip with a plug in tester, almost always that means there is no EGC. Show AHJ mfg instructions

This is the 2023

(A) Dwelling Units.
All 120-volt, single-phase, 15- and 20-ampere branch circuits supplying outlets or devices installed in dwelling unit kitchens, family rooms, dining rooms, living rooms, parlors, libraries, dens, bedrooms, sunrooms, recreation rooms, closets, hallways, laundry areas, or similar rooms or areas shall be protected by any of the means described in 210.12(A)(1) through (6):

 

[Duneit]

This is the 2023

The AFCI breakers are not in bathroom receptacles, just about every other circuit in the house. Half of them don't trip with his tester. This is the only inspector I've come across that uses one of these and doesn't just push the test button on the breaker. This is a 6,000 + custom home is why there are so many circuits

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Same inspector is using a $30 Klein afci/gfci tester and says 50 of the 100 brand new breakers are bad and wants me to prove they are functioning properly

There was a local electrician who ran into this issue many years ago. It turned out that the tester wouldn't work properly when the run was over 75'. Since this is a large home I will guess that most circuits are over 75'

It was interesting because the inspector would test one receptacle and all was fine but when he move to the next receptacle it would trip. That second receptacle put the distance over 75'.