Junction Box Location

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BradVO

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Dubuque, Iowa, USA
I live in a house that has a removable bookshelf. Behind that bookshelf is the backside to a fire place. In that space is located a junction box with some wires spliced together. Is this legal? What if there would be a sign or decal on the bookshelf stating that a junction box was located inside? I'm trying to figure if I have to correct this or will this require tearing into the walls to run new lines.

Thanks in advance.
 
Welcome to the forum. Since the bookshelf is removable, I believe your box meets 314.29 re: accessibility. Of course, the j-box must be covered, and the box has to meet other codes regarding setback (<1/4", flush if the wall surface is made from a combustible material) and the space around it (<1/8" gap).

You do not need signage tho it would be nice if when you sell the house you inform the next person it's there - hunting for hidden jboxes can burn crazy amounts of time that no one likes paying for. You could make a label for it if you wanted to.
 
Sort of no different then having a junction box in an attic, then to make things worse have it buried in thermal insulation. It is still accessible.
 
kwired said:
Sort of no different then having a junction box in an attic, then to make things worse have it buried in thermal insulation. It is still accessible.
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I believe some states do not allow that. I seem to recall Tom Baker saying Washington state doesnt allow that.

If I had to put a jbox in an attic and I knew it would wind up under 18" of blown-in, I would hang a tag from the rafter above the box to indicate its presence, and I think that or equivalent should be code. or not allow it altogether.
 
JFletcher said:
I believe some states do not allow that. I seem to recall Tom Baker saying Washington state doesnt allow that.

If I had to put a jbox in an attic and I knew it would wind up under 18" of blown-in, I would hang a tag from the rafter above the box to indicate its presence, and I think that or equivalent should be code. or not allow it altogether.
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I have had inspectors here in WA ask if there were any Jboxes down low and if so I needed a flag to mark them (which never mattered to me cuz I always put them up high). IVe always wondered if that was actually code so I just checked. Looks like it is:

Washington Administrative Code 296-46B-314.001: (1) Conduit bodies, junction, pull, and outlet boxes must be installed so that the wiring contained in them is accessible without removing any part of the building structure, including insulation material.
 
electrofelon said:
I have had inspectors here in WA ask if there were any Jboxes down low and if so I needed a flag to mark them (which never mattered to me cuz I always put them up high). IVe always wondered if that was actually code so I just checked. Looks like it is:

Washington Administrative Code 296-46B-314.001: (1) Conduit bodies, junction, pull, and outlet boxes must be installed so that the wiring contained in them is accessible without removing any part of the building structure, including insulation material.
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What good does flagging them do when it comes to accessing them without removing the insulation material? Seems contradictory to require flagging them when the rule is worded as it is.

That said I still think flagging them is a good idea - but per NEC alone not a requirement.
 
Although I can see a flag being helpful, I have to stop and laugh at some of the local rules some of you guys have to follow.

JAP>
 
kwired said:
What good does flagging them do when it comes to accessing them without removing the insulation material? Seems contradictory to require flagging them when the rule is worded as it is.

That said I still think flagging them is a good idea - but per NEC alone not a requirement.
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Yeah good point. There is no allowance or exception in there for flagging :slaphead: . This was seattle city that told me that and they are generally more easy going than the state inspectors
 
I would label the outside of the panel cover. Most troubleshooting would involve the panel at some point I would assume.


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giovanni0502 said:
I would label the outside of the panel cover. Most troubleshooting would involve the panel at some point I would assume.


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That's a good idea.
Write down the GPS coordinates of each J-box and circuit number on the panel cover.
That way you could find the problem easily with your phone on those 130 degree days crawling around in the attic.


JAP>
 
jap said:
That's a good idea.
Write down the GPS coordinates of each J-box and circuit number on the panel cover.
That way you could find the problem easily with your phone on those 130 degree days crawling around in the attic.


JAP>
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As accurate as most cell phones seem to be when you try to be within just a foot or two for accuracy - mine would be telling me what I am looking for is 10 more feet north, when I am already at the furthest north portion of said attic:blink:
 
kwired said:
As accurate as most cell phones seem to be when you try to be within just a foot or two for accuracy - mine would be telling me what I am looking for is 10 more feet north, when I am already at the furthest north portion of said attic:blink:
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I was somewhat joking about this to begin with.

I'm so old fashion I'd have to have an active Wifi to use my phone or my wife would scold me for using the extra data. :)


JAP>
 
jap said:
I was somewhat joking about this to begin with.

I'm so old fashion I'd have to have an active Wifi to use my phone or my wife would scold me for using the extra data. :)


JAP>
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I sort of was joking also, but I do use my phone or even google maps to measure long runs quite often, but you have to learn to pad the measurement some or you may find out it wasn't accurate and end up short if you order materials with your GPS measurements. Were talking measurements of 200-3000 feet at times. "Roll-a-tape" never comes up with same measurement twice on those 1000'+ measurements unless you are measuring on a paved surface.
 
electrofelon said:
Yeah good point. There is no allowance or exception in there for flagging :slaphead: . This was seattle city that told me that and they are generally more easy going than the state inspectors
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What? The state of seattle is more easier going that our state inspectors?
 
jap said:
Although I can see a flag being helpful, I have to stop and laugh at some of the local rules some of you guys have to follow.

JAP>
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I think the WA state rule is great, tho I could live with a compromise of "no boxes or condulets hidden, obscured, or buried by removable insulation of any type, unless its location is marked directly above by clear signage attached to the framing members".

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Burying jboxes in insulation is a dick move imo. I would never screw the next man who might have to find it or work on it, which inevitably will be late in the afternoon on a hot August day, and inevitably be ME.

giovanni0502 said:
I would label the outside of the panel cover. Most troubleshooting would involve the panel at some point I would assume.
Click to expand...

Good idea. Inside sheet may be better, tho either way making some effort for the next guy is always appreciated, probably because it's so seldomly done.
 
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electrofelon said:
Yeah I think the no buried j-box rule is stupid. It's a design issue.
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Put them up between overhead framing members in a low clearance crawl space and even with no insulation they can be difficult to find, but still are "accessible".

And above suspended ceiling that has thermal insulation laying on the tiles - PIA.
 
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