Kitchen hood - shunt trip breakers required.

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normbac

Senior Member
The problem with the diagram is most fire suppression systems have only two micro switches on the head, one set is almost always used by the fire alarm system, and the other set is for the shut down. You are showing three micro switches in the diagram. ;)

This was for a taco shop I did and there was 4 Switches so I used three since they were there unused.
 

hillbilly1

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,Ga
Occupation
Field coordinator/ technical support
This was for a taco shop I did and there was 4 Switches so I used three since they were there unused.

Did they have two different enclosures? Two in one, with the other two in another? I have been waiting to be busted by the AHJ'S on having the 24 volt alarm in the same enclosure as the 120 volt shunt trip wiring, but in nearly 30 years, they have yet to say anything. I figure someone figured that out, and is making the manufacture separate it.
 

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Did they have two different enclosures? Two in one, with the other two in another? I have been waiting to be busted by the AHJ'S on having the 24 volt alarm in the same enclosure as the 120 volt shunt trip wiring, but in nearly 30 years, they have yet to say anything. I figure someone figured that out, and is making the manufacture separate it.

In my opinion it is not a violation.



760.136 Separation from Electric Light, Power, Class 1,
NPLFA, and Medium-Power Network-Powered Broadband
Communications Circuit Conductors.


(D) Associated Systems Within Enclosures. Power-limited
fire alarm conductors in compartments, enclosures, device
boxes, outlet boxes, or similar fittings shall be permitted
to be installed with electric light, power, Class 1, non?
power-limited fire alarm, and medium power networkpowered
broadband communications circuits where they
are introduced solely to connect the equipment connected
to power-limited fire alarm circuits, and comply
with either of the following conditions:

(1) The electric light, power, Class 1, non?power-limited
fire alarm, and medium-power network-powered broadband
communications circuit conductors are routed to
maintain a minimum of 6 mm (0.25 in.) separation
from the conductors and cables of power-limited fire
alarm circuits.

(2) The circuit conductors operate at 150 volts or less to
ground and also comply with one of the following:

a. The fire alarm power-limited circuits are installed
using Type FPL, FPLR, FPLP, or permitted substitute
cables, provided these power-limited cable conductors
extending beyond the jacket are separated
by a minimum of 6 mm (0.25 in.) or by a nonconductive
sleeve or nonconductive barrier from all
other conductors.

b. The power-limited fire alarm circuit conductors are
installed as non?power-limited circuits in accordance
with 760.46.
 

gadfly56

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Professional Engineer, Fire & Life Safety
Did they have two different enclosures? Two in one, with the other two in another? I have been waiting to be busted by the AHJ'S on having the 24 volt alarm in the same enclosure as the 120 volt shunt trip wiring, but in nearly 30 years, they have yet to say anything. I figure someone figured that out, and is making the manufacture separate it.

The Ansul Automan regulator can fit up to 4 micro switches; I'm not sure how many it ships with. The Kidde XV control head (which is also the Badger control head) can accommodate 4 micro switches in 2 different mounting positions and ships with 2. I'm not sure about the Ansul Automan, but the Kidde XV has 2 knockouts at the lower left of the case so you could separate the high and low voltage into separate JB's, which in fact is what we do.

And I'll go along with iwire, I don't think we have a violation in any event.

One thing though, if you wire up one of these, you CAN NOT make the connection inside the control box. None of the system enclosures out there are listed for use as a junction box. You must pull the leads out of the control box and make the connection in an external JB.
 

hillbilly1

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,Ga
Occupation
Field coordinator/ technical support
The Ansul Automan regulator can fit up to 4 micro switches; I'm not sure how many it ships with. The Kidde XV control head (which is also the Badger control head) can accommodate 4 micro switches in 2 different mounting positions and ships with 2. I'm not sure about the Ansul Automan, but the Kidde XV has 2 knockouts at the lower left of the case so you could separate the high and low voltage into separate JB's, which in fact is what we do.

And I'll go along with iwire, I don't think we have a violation in any event.

One thing though, if you wire up one of these, you CAN NOT make the connection inside the control box. None of the system enclosures out there are listed for use as a junction box. You must pull the leads out of the control box and make the connection in an external JB.

Interesting, I have yet to see one set up with that option actually installed, all of the ones I have hooked up came with a handy box mounted on it, I don't know if was factory, or the fire suppression installer that put it on, but connections are in a j box, not the head.
 

gadfly56

Senior Member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Professional Engineer, Fire & Life Safety
Interesting, I have yet to see one set up with that option actually installed, all of the ones I have hooked up came with a handy box mounted on it, I don't know if was factory, or the fire suppression installer that put it on, but connections are in a j box, not the head.

Nice to know folks in your neck of the woods seem to know what they are doing. Here, not so much, apparently.
 

hillbilly1

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,Ga
Occupation
Field coordinator/ technical support
Nice to know folks in your neck of the woods seem to know what they are doing. Here, not so much, apparently.

They seem to be like transformers, it's so simple, but tends to confuse a lot of people! I have to beat it into a lot of my guys heads too! :D
 
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