Know it all customer!!

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Re: Know it all customer!!

Estimates are just that.It is a price to install or repair a specific job.The customer should receive only 1 number ,and that is the total price.You might need to tell them where the panel will be going but never details as to size of wire or materials required.Details like how to run it or materials needed are for your use if you get the job.
I too made this mistake once on some apartments that were changing from stacked washer/dryer to seperate units.They paid our price to do the first one and then there maintenance man just copy what i did on the others.Not sure how or if we coulda stopped that one.
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

We still live in a free country I believe.

Yup, you do have a point but places like HD make it a little TOO easy. Like a kid in a candy store, DIYer's and home owners are encouraged by the material on the shelves in plain sight and there for the taking. If they had to go to a supply house like we do they come up against the "intimidation factor". They can't just grab something off the shelf that looks like it may work. They would have to stand there with tradesmen and tell the counterperson what it is they want... if they can survive the snickers and dirty looks. :D

-Hal
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

sometimes window shopping is good,,,it helps me remember i just may need something i forgot! not to mention the counter person at the supply house may have worked at HD the week before and is still a bit confused as to what i want/asking for but to be fair, i dont think the counter person worked at HD,,why would he take a cut in pay and benefits! I will salute a goooooood counter person at the electrical supply house,,,,if they are good, they are very much a major help but probably underpaid... so it all goes around in a circle,,,,how much money do you think the guy at the counter of your local supply house makes an hour? as much as an electrician? 1/2?
1/3? how many benefits? probably not many,,if any!
HD has benefits last i heard....now whos best for the local community? and on one last note,,,a lot of the supply houses are large chain outfits not much different than HD,,,maybe not as big, but they are a chain outfit.....not mom and pop operations...
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

it all boils down to customer service ---- supply houses in south florida are terrible! can't communicate - can't fill an order - don't maintain proper stocks - rank zero on custoner service. few weeks ago, i was helping one of my employees fix up a house he was moving into. i ordered six recessed retrofit hogh hat cans on tuesday---didn't get them on wednesday --called thursday and my salesman said he couldn't find them in their stock and then told me "you can pick them up at home depot, besides there cheaper there".! i don't feel bad when i shop there!!!!
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

Originally posted by charlie tuna:
...supply houses in south florida are terrible! can't communicate...
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Ouch! Try not to be so encompassing. The houses here is SW Florida aren't all that bad. They are having a hard time keeping up with the incredible growth, but most will do whatever it takes to make things right and to provide good service. :)
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

I got the idea of restricting electrical supplies from a rule we have here in southeastern MI. You can not buy a furnace here in less you are liscened, big orange does not sell them. I have never seen anyone get around it. I am not saying it does not happen but I have not seen it.

Does orange sell furnaces/ac compressors in other areas?
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

in texas it is tuff to buy AC(central units) and no gas without the AC license.....some get around it...

but be careful of what u wish for, it can rub off on other trades!
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

Just got a call from the from "the know it all customer"this morning. Seems that she has had second thoughts about her jack leg friend. He did the boat house wiring this weekend. She wanted me to come up there today and check out his wiring!!!She told me that the lights are very dim and the ceiling fans sound like the trolling motor on her boat. I asked her if the inspector was coming today to inspect his work. She said " WHAT INSPECTOR".He never pulled a permit for the job! I asked her if she saw on my list of materials/job scope if there was a memo to call the inspections dept. to get the inspectors name for the area(never worked in this area).I told her after she called the inspector and her turned down the job and fined the jack leg for working w/o a license and w/o a permit to give me a call. I also told her my rates, and surprisingly they have tripled. There was silence on the other end of the line, could have sworn I heard something hit the floor. :D
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

Wayne- There is no better justice than what transpired. Stick to your guns, the last thing you want is to go back to the job without a violation in place. Without a violation in place, I wouldn't go fishing on her boat! Stay well my friend.
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

Thanks Mega, I feel for the her though. This may end up really bad for her in many ways. I don't think she even has a building permit to build that boat house(found this out last Fri.). Also, the state doesn't allow any plumbing on structures built on lakes either. She has had someone install a kichen sink a shower and a water heater on it as well.I am just going to sit back and watch what transpires before I make a move. She may have to start all over again.
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

Why would you even spend 5 more minutes on her ?
Other than lack of permit the only other known problem is the voltage drop.That is not a violation.Hopefully when this is all over her Mr fixit all will be fined.Then again she might try that old my husband or boyfriend did it at no charge.Her cure seems rather easy.She won't call for an inspection (care to maybe call it for her ?, you did everything else for her free so why not top it off with this ).You already told her the cure,larger wire.So now what ? go check his work and repair it ? There are times to walk away,OOOPS RUN and this is one of them.Touch this and it's now yours.
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

I want her to beg me to come back and do it so I can have the satisfaction of telling her that I am to busy to fix her screw up!!
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

With all the electrical contractors available i very much dought she will beg you.Do hope someone tends to her problem before anything burns up.She has egg on face so either her man will fix it or someone else will.Hope she has not paid him yet.He undertook a job that was over his head.Had he followed your material list he might have done ok but still had your service for free
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

I would look at his work for her (with a service call charge...of course :D ). Cash only on this service charge. After looking at it, I would tell her that the system is wired incorrectly and what I now charge to repair it. Thats all of the information that I would give her. I would not tell her "the fix" for the problem. I would just charge to fix it.....thats what we do....fix stuff.
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

So you are going to turn down this work and any future work from her so that you can satisfy your ego and get to say, "I told you so."

Now who's doing the wrong thing?

You could easily have your self a money making job here. Tell you want time and materials at x dollars per hour to fix the problems and make sure that the whole job is up to code. You may have to just replace the feeder, or you may have to replace other items or at least fix up the work. Either way you make money and she gets her job done properly and safely.
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

I haven't read through all of the responses in this thread but I'm sure you are getting a lot of support. You are absolutely correct that she is in the wrong but I do have some concerns.

I get the impression now and also with your opening thread that there is a certain animosity between you and your potential customer. If in fact this customer is being treated the way it sounds, were it me, I would have found another contractor long ago. This sounds like a very uninformed individual and I don't get the impression that the situation has been handled with the proper professionalism that I would expect from a contractor, especially considering her lack of knowledge.

Don't get too high on your pedestal because you have experience that your customer does not. She has every right to shop around for other service providers and because she does so doesn't make her a know-it-all customer. You are correct that she made some very bad choices and now must suffer the consequences. It sounds like it may be possible she had no clue that permits, licensing, and inspections would be required. Luckily, the bad choices showed up in the end result now rather than in the form of fire or injury later.

I remember the first time I decided to repair a broken fence on my first property. I had no clue that a permit was required. The same goes for the electrical work I did in my garage at that time. Luckily, I did it correctly even though I had never even heard of the NEC before then. Obviously, there was no inspection ordered.

Is it any more right for you to rape her by tripling your price? Sounds like you're taking advantage of a situation and gouging a naive customer. I could only see this as partially appropriate if she demanded that you expedite the work by rescheduling your now booked schedule. She will be punished enough by her mistakes and I don't believe it to be in your best interest to burn bridges. It could come back and haunt you later.

There is no place for you to make her beg. Don't let your pride get in your way here as then you come across as a know-it-all contractor? :(

Bob
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

Normally i would say fix it.But here i see a DIY looking for more free advice.If he touches this he just married the job and everything the handyman did.Sometimes you must black ball a customer unless you like headaches.A mess like this could end up with her suing the first guy and now guess what ? your a witness unpaid again.Do yourself a favor and tell her your too busy.Be nice about it but let her find someone else unless you want involved in some more free work.
Might add this.In future do not give the customer material lists or details beyond what is a must.If your running conduit just tell them what area you will be digging but not the size of it or the size of wire or what breaker size or other details.They should have the drawings not you furnish them.Had this been done right you may or maynot got the job .

[ June 07, 2004, 01:46 PM: Message edited by: jimwalker ]
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

OK, so here is what I am going to do. I am going to go out and take a look see. I will not take the first tool out of my truck and I will not offer any explanations as to what the problem is. This job will be done by my terms only and it will be inspected along with the rest of the construction. I am going to charge her for a svc. call and 3 hrs ride time and she is going to be informed of this before I go there. If she agrees to my terms I will give her a not to exceed price for the work to be done and a contract will be written and signed by both of us before I leave the site. Isn't it ridiculas the things we have to do to these days. I will also be towing my boat up there just in case she decides to turn me down. Maybe I'll motor up to her boathouse and catch a few big catfish and laugh at the humming ceiling fans.
 
Re: Know it all customer!!

Originally posted by wayne123:
Maybe I'll motor up to her boathouse and catch a few big catfish and laugh at the humming ceiling fans.
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Wayne, I think that's very fair. Let us know what happens, please. I'ld like to hear this one. :)

PS. Not to disagree with bthielen, but I think Wayne had a natural human reaction. I think the reaction was a first thought response. I know my thought would have been charge her more, but I've done a job for people in a bind, and came back and lowered my price after seening the need even though they tried to rake me over the coals.

However, I think you (Wayne) are handling it well, by giving her another chance.

Bthielen's response is the proper way, but I garantee about 90-95% of the people in the same situation would have been offended by her, so they would have thought the "not so" professional way. You think?? :eek:
 
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