Know of an Economical 120/240 AC Single Ø NEMA 3/3R Panel; 20A Bolt On Breakers?

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Installer

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DesMoines, Washington
Our work has a specification for 120/240 AC Single Ø Weatherproof NEMA 3 or 3R Panels with 20 A Bolt On Breakers.
Often the Equipment we are feeding only requires 4 or 5 circuits at the most.
The only panels I am finding are Square D or Seimens and they have 20 breakers and cost almost $ 2000 , which seems like a waste of resources and money
Does anyone out there know of something more reasonable?
 
Cutler hammer breakers are what I use and they are usually quite well priced. But I get better pricing than most as I’ve bought their breakers for over 15 years


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Installer said:
Our work has a specification for 120/240 AC Single Ø Weatherproof NEMA 3 or 3R Panels with 20 A Bolt On Breakers.
Often the Equipment we are feeding only requires 4 or 5 circuits at the most.
The only panels I am finding are Square D or Seimens and they have 20 breakers and cost almost $ 2000 , which seems like a waste of resources and money
Does anyone out there know of something more reasonable?
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could you use normal breakers with the hold down bracket instead of bolt on breakers?
 
Besoeker said:
Do you guys use DIN rail mounting breakers or other electrical components?
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Not often. Up until recently, they were not UL-489 listed (and even now, very few are), so they could only be used as "supplemental" circuit protection, beaning DOWNSTREAM from some other UL-489 listed breaker, which make them basically pointless. For the few that are listed as UL-489 for Branch Protection, the cost is a lot higher than what we pay for our style breakers, and the boxes are often not UL listed, so you have to cobble something together on your own. So they don't get used unless maybe for industrial control panels where there is a custom box anyway.
 
Are you seeing these prices online or getting quotes from a supply house? If you are looking a list prices online they are not even close to accurate. Since you want bolt-on breakers you need a panelboard instead of a loadcenter. 3R boxes for panelboards are pricey compared to NEMA 1 but the interior and breakers will be about the same a loadcenter if you get them factory assembled. A 1-phase 100 amp 120/240 volt main lug 20 circuit panelboard with 5 1-pole 20 amp breakers should be closer to $500 - $600.
 
Jraef said:
So they don't get used unless maybe for industrial control panels where there is a custom box anyway.
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That's mostly what we made. Industrial panels but mostly in standard enclosures like Eldon or Rittal.

One of the merits of the DIN rail breakers is they are quick to fit - just snap on to the rail and job done. And they are not expensive here at least. I can get C curve units rated from 6A to 63A for about $3.50 UD taking account of our discount and current exchange rate.

I understand your point about UL listing. I don't know whether are or could be. The applicable standard is EN60896.
I know this has been a bit off topic but I think it is sometimes interesting to see different approaches.
 
Jraef said:
The issue you are having is in wanting to use bolt-on breakers.
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Agree.

Square D catalog shows 18 spaces as the smallest you can get.

Also with their product a 3R enclosure is also rated NEMA 5 and 12. To get 3R you remove plugs in the bottom for drainage. Much "tighter" enclosure then one that has a 3R only rating.
 
Besoeker said:
That's mostly what we made. Industrial panels but mostly in standard enclosures like Eldon or Rittal.

One of the merits of the DIN rail breakers is they are quick to fit - just snap on to the rail and job done. And they are not expensive here at least. I can get C curve units rated from 6A to 63A for about $3.50 UD taking account of our discount and current exchange rate.

I understand your point about UL listing. I don't know whether are or could be. The applicable standard is EN60896.
I know this has been a bit off topic but I think it is sometimes interesting to see different approaches.
Click to expand...

I use the AB 1489 DIN rail mounted breakers. I like them. I wish they had a decent way to padlock them. The attachment they sell for that purpose is pretty shakey.

We pay a lot more than $3.50 each for them though.
 
Can you please identify a source?

Can you please identify a source?

curt swartz said:
Are you seeing these prices online or getting quotes from a supply house? If you are looking a list prices online they are not even close to accurate. Since you want bolt-on breakers you need a panelboard instead of a loadcenter. 3R boxes for panelboards are pricey compared to NEMA 1 but the interior and breakers will be about the same a loadcenter if you get them factory assembled. A 1-phase 100 amp 120/240 volt main lug 20 circuit panelboard with 5 1-pole 20 amp breakers should be closer to $500 - $600.
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Can you please identify a source? Thanks
 
petersonra said:
The Steiner Electric website says they are $2700. :)
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I had a chat with someone about this. It turns out the price for just the box really is insane. However, if you buy it with the bus installed already it is a LOT less.

My suggestion is getting a price for the box with the bus installed instead of piecing it together yourself.
 
petersonra said:
I use the AB 1489 DIN rail mounted breakers. I like them. I wish they had a decent way to padlock them. The attachment they sell for that purpose is pretty shakey.

We pay a lot more than $3.50 each for them though.
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Eaton FAZ series DIN rail circuit breakers are available online, 1 pole for $19. 2 and 3 pole are available as well, in C and D curve. Still more expensive than a regular circuit breaker but cheap compared to list price on an AB 1489 breaker. And they are basically identical in form, fit and function.
 
Stop looking online and call a supply house. Online pricing is meaningless for panelboards. They need to be quoted from the manufacture or a supplier that is set up to provide direct quotes. Some supply houses stock panelboard components but it is more expensive that way. You normally order factory assembled including breakers.

I have 2 projects going right now with 400 amp 120/240 1P Main Lug 30 circuit panelboards with NEMA 3R/5/12 boxes. Total pricing from IEM and SquareD $600-$700.
 
curt swartz said:
Are you seeing these prices online or getting quotes from a supply house? If you are looking a list prices online they are not even close to accurate. Since you want bolt-on breakers you need a panelboard instead of a loadcenter. 3R boxes for panelboards are pricey compared to NEMA 1 but the interior and breakers will be about the same a loadcenter if you get them factory assembled. A 1-phase 100 amp 120/240 volt main lug 20 circuit panelboard with 5 1-pole 20 amp breakers should be closer to $500 - $600.
Click to expand...


I agree and even going to the wrong supply house if you don't have an account with them will get you screwed.

Edit: You are right, call around.
 
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