KnowItAll new guy gets spanked

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sparky59 said:
i think a hi leg panel should be required to have a warning label. something more than the orange tape on the 208.
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We usually write "Caution: Hi-leg Delta" with a Sharpie. Also, when we install new panels we put a orange "tape tab" on the 'B' buss that is not being used. And, write "high leg" on the breaker KOs. You'd have to be blind or blonde to miss it.

growler said:
How old is this guy? There used to be a lot of guys like that but I thought most of them had died out.
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I'm an "old guy" too, I guess.

Had a "old guy" one time on an old, old warehouse not check voltage. I asked him three times, "Did you check the voltage?" Him, "Nah, don't worry. It has to be 120/208. It's commercial." He cooked a frig and a small back-up generator.

Another time a guy hooked his hole hawg up to a temp breaker in a panel. Landed his breaker on the high-leg. Boy did that hole hawg sing!
 
I had just started as a maintenance electrician (first day) and the old guy took me around and was letting me know how long he had been doing electrical work and blah blah blah. Get into an area and he says lets see if we can figure this out, we hooked this equipment up 2 days ago and nothings working, blah blah blah again. So with him and our supervisor standing there I open the first j-box and said "here's your problem you have the neutrals spliced wrong". Swapped them around and everything came on.

We actually became good friends.
 
i think a hi leg panel should be required to have a warning label. something more than the orange tape on the 208.
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I think you should know what you are doing if you get into a panel.:rolleyes:

There is a lot of old delta stuff here, even some residential for the old AC units. I am pretty sure this is one of the first things I learned.

We mark the hell out of the delta panels including the pry unused KO breaker slots and sometimes the bus on resi panels.

High leg voltage seems to be just under 200V here according to my meters.
 
seen this happen many a time. most of the time it happens to inexperienced folks. If they are a Master then they obviously not well rounded.

not reffering to the spare tires some of us have....;)
 
220/221 said:
I think you should know what you are doing if you get into a panel.:rolleyes:

High leg voltage seems to be just under 200V here according to my meters.
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I see that too.

I was thinking myself that we see 190-200v range on most of the stuff we digitally measure.
 
blue spark said:
Just thought I'd share this with you. About 6 months ago we hired a new master. Nice guy, pretty professional, and a hard worker. I get along with him great except he is really set in his ways and always the first to say "Well in the cities we never did it that way....". Granted I'm only a JM but I've been with the company for 6 years now and know what the boss expects and wants. It would get to the point of arguing with me that my way was the wrong way. He was mostly a service guy so he's somewhat familiar with light commercial. Anywho...
He was sent to a bakery/coffee place to install some new circuits for a freezer and a coffee grinder. He had our new apprentice along. After everything is installed he goes to land the circuits. Well you can guess what happened next. Brand new commercial freezer turned into a meat smoker in no time flat. Yeah, that orange wire, that's the stinger. :rolleyes: I've pulled a few in my time but I had to chuckle a little.
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"the cities" is sooooo Minnesota :) Yeah you betcha!
 
I was thinking myself that we see 190-200v range on most of the stuff we digitally measure.
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I avoid referring to it as "208" because that seems to confuse the issue. Someone here tried to explain that it mathmatically could not be 190ish but every time I read it, it is in the 190's.

I mark them "Caution: 3 phase DELTA system. "B" phase is 200 volts to ground" then mark the "B" blanks "200V"

In the olden days, the high,wild,stinger,bastard phase was "C". The POCOS still want it on "C" and we have to switch it over after the meter.
 
I am a Master, and I have hooked up a set of lights to the wild leg as well.
I noticed it was a delta system, but landed the breaker on the wrong leg anyway....perception problem from looking at a downward angle into the panel.
I was smart enough to notice they were entirely too bright and shut them down before any damage.

Now, my latest delta problem was in troubleshooting. 200 amp service feeding one three phase twenty horse pump. Pump does not run, power on all three phases, 120v, 120v, 200v to ground. I can see both transformers overhead, both jacks inserted, what the he77? I try bumping the pump and lose voltage on one phase. Jump in the truck, start chasing wires and finally find that thrown jack on the poco line about 2 miles away.
I hate delta...I really hate it when the poco uses two phases to make three.
 
You need to get the voltages right. I think there is a rounding issue. You will get the following L-N/L-L/High-N voltages:
110/220/190
115/230/200
120/240/208
125/250/217
130/260/225

You are not going to have 120/240/190.
 
220/221 said:
I avoid referring to it as "208" because that seems to confuse the issue. Someone here tried to explain that it mathmatically could not be 190ish but every time I read it, it is in the 190's.

I mark them "Caution: 3 phase DELTA system. "B" phase is 200 volts to ground" then mark the "B" blanks "200V"

In the olden days, the high,wild,stinger,bastard phase was "C". The POCOS still want it on "C" and we have to switch it over after the meter.
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That would be like labeling 120/220. You are using two different voltage references. Stop it or else the math police will get you!:grin:
 
mivey said:
That would be like labeling 120/220. You are using two different voltage references. Stop it or else the math police will get you!:grin:
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Math and physics work differently in AZ, it has something to do with Fahrenheits :grin:

Roger
 
mivey said:
That would be like labeling 120/220. You are using two different voltage references. Stop it or else the math police will get you!:grin:
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How can he be true to his screen name if he uses real voltages? :D
 
Hasn't everyone smoked something connecting to 208V? That's how you remember not to use it in the future. I was lucky & only smoked a hand grinder. I lost a bid to a guy that smoked an expensive table saw when he did the job.

Dave
 
Sparky555 said:
Hasn't everyone smoked something connecting to 208V? That's how you remember not to use it in the future. I was lucky & only smoked a hand grinder. I lost a bid to a guy that smoked an expensive table saw when he did the job.

Dave
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Worst I've ever seen is a guy hooked up the 120v supply of a fire alarm panel to the detection circuit. $68K of addressable system went "poof!"
 
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