L feet for shingles

[solarken]

I am not sure you will find too many solar installers that know anything about composition shingle and flashing methodologies.

Really? Any solar installer that has been around before surface mount butyl or caulk sealed mounting products should understand how to properly install the old flashed lag screw mounts, the flashed jboxes, how to properly seal a drilled hole that missed a hoist, and how to install and flash roof anchors.

 

[electrofelon]

Really? Any solar installer that has been around before surface mount butyl or caulk sealed mounting products should understand how to properly install the old flashed lag screw mounts, the flashed jboxes, how to properly seal a drilled hole that missed a hoist, and how to install and flash roof anchors.

"Should" , yes.

 

[pkhosravani]

My impression is that many roofers in the U.S. who work on roofs may not have a deep understanding of the underlying theory. They tend to follow the procedures as they were taught, focusing on completing the task efficiently rather than questioning the rationale behind each step. Given the physically demanding and often hazardous nature of the work, it is understandable that they just want to do the work, get off the roof as fast as possible, and make a paycheck. According to data from Indeed, the average wage for roofers is $24.09 per hour, which further highlights the challenges of attracting and retaining skilled labor in this field. For a deeper understanding of roofing theory, one might seek out seasoned professionals who are no longer active in the field, but who now work in the office. However, it is not uncommon for individuals with decades of experience to be somewhat skeptical of newer technologies or approaches, such as the integration of solar panels, due to long-held practices and perspectives shaped by years in the industry.

 

[jaggedben]

My impression is that many roofers in the U.S. who work on roofs may not have a deep understanding of the underlying theory. They tend to follow the procedures as they were taught, focusing on completing the task efficiently rather than questioning the rationale behind each step. Given the physically demanding and often hazardous nature of the work, it is understandable that they just want to do the work, get off the roof as fast as possible, and make a paycheck. According to data from Indeed, the average wage for roofers is $24.09 per hour, which further highlights the challenges of attracting and retaining skilled labor in this field. For a deeper understanding of roofing theory, one might seek out seasoned professionals who are no longer active in the field, but who now work in the office. However, it is not uncommon for individuals with decades of experience to be somewhat skeptical of newer technologies or approaches, such as the integration of solar panels, due to long-held practices and perspectives shaped by years in the industry.

I disagree with the general thrust of your comment. I think that those in the roofing industry who make decisions about materials and methods have a deep understanding of the theory. I daresay that on average, in my experience, they understand the theory behind their trade significantly better than electrical contractors. The average wage of roofing laborers is entirely inappropriate for judging the experience and understanding of the roofing contractors who make the important decisions.

 

[jaggedben]

I disagree in the end with a lot of the comments that have been made in this thread, although some good points have been made and I don't see the purpose of taking a side on some of these methods. I'll say this though: when a residential customer is getting a new roof, and we're given a free choice (customer is willing to pay any higher cost) between installing posts on the paper and having the roofer flash them traditionally, versus any retrofit method of any kind, I'll have the roofer flash in the posts every. single. time.

 

[pkhosravani]

I know many solar installers who don’t fully understand the theoretical aspects of solar power generation either. My broader point is that the solar industry is pushing the boundaries of what can—and is—being installed on rooftops today. Naturally, we’ll see pushback from roofing professionals, as roofs have traditionally been their domain, so to speak. Ultimately, the key measure of success is whether these solar installations compromise roof integrity, leading to issues like leaks, ice damming, etc. I'd rather rely on the results of millions of rooftop solar systems than what a roofer could tell us about what may or may not happen.

 

[solarken]

I disagree in the end with a lot of the comments that have been made in this thread, although some good points have been made and I don't see the purpose of taking a side on some of these methods. I'll say this though: when a residential customer is getting a new roof, and we're given a free choice (customer is willing to pay any higher cost) between installing posts on the paper and having the roofer flash them traditionally, versus any retrofit method of any kind, I'll have the roofer flash in the posts every. single. time.

Just curious, how often have you had an issue with where they placed the mount vs where you asked them to place them? I ask because a roofer may not understand the importance of having all the mounts align with the rail direction, or other aspects of the array installation. I'm not saying to do so is wrong, just these are things I have thought about when considering asking a roofer to install mounts on a new roof. The few times I really intended to, I felt it best for me to mark the locations after they did the tearoff and put the iceguard/paper on, but it seemed I could not get enough coordination of schedule to be able to make that happen.

 

[jaggedben]

Just curious, how often have you had an issue with where they placed the mount vs where you asked them to place them? I ask because a roofer may not understand the importance of having all the mounts align with the rail direction, or other aspects of the array installation. I'm not saying to do so is wrong, just these are things I have thought about when considering asking a roofer to install mounts on a new roof. The few times I really intended to, I felt it best for me to mark the locations after they did the tearoff and put the iceguard/paper on, but it seemed I could not get enough coordination of schedule to be able to make that happen.

The roofers don't install the mounts. We do. The roofers just flash them. It's like adding a whole bunch of plumbing vents as far as they're concerned. Some want to charge the homeowner more, which has sometimes been a sticking point. A possible extra day on site for 1-2 guys is worth the highly reduced likelihood of leaks, IMO.

 

[PWDickerson]

The roofers don't install the mounts. We do. The roofers just flash them. It's like adding a whole bunch of plumbing vents as far as they're concerned. Some want to charge the homeowner more, which has sometimes been a sticking point. A possible extra day on site for 1-2 guys is worth the highly reduced likelihood of leaks, IMO.

And worth not having to void the roofer's warranty.

 

[Carultch]

The roofers don't install the mounts. We do. The roofers just flash them. It's like adding a whole bunch of plumbing vents as far as they're concerned. Some want to charge the homeowner more, which has sometimes been a sticking point. A possible extra day on site for 1-2 guys is worth the highly reduced likelihood of leaks, IMO.

If you can commit to the locations in advance, you can negotiate roofers to install the flashing mounts when new shingles are being installed. Coordinate when setting up the contract with the roofer.

There's an advantage to them installing the flashings in their workflow, compared to retrofitting them. They can see the sheathing fasteners to know exactly where the rafters are, and lap flashings into the shingle layers without upper layers and their nails in the way.

 

[Zee]

I learned to install the posts myself.
And to supply the flashings whenever possible.
They do not understand nominal vs true OD.
If I tell them 1" diameter posts ....they will get 1-3/8" ....correct flashings for a " 1" " pipe.!
The posts will be in the wrong place.
And they will be loose and split or miss rafters.

I do however have the utmost respect for their knowledge about roofing and ensuring a waterproof home.
They have been around the block on a lot of things. We may think something is the next best thing, but a roofer may know why it has not been done that way. Sometimes though, certain solar products are the next best thing. Tough call.

 

[Carultch]

I learned to install the posts myself.
And to supply the flashings whenever possible.
They do not understand nominal vs true OD.
If I tell them 1" diameter posts ....they will get 1-3/8" ....correct flashings for a " 1" " pipe.!

This is indeed a pain point, which is why I recommend clearly indicating the context of the information you give, and give both nominal and actual sizes when applicable to coordinating with other trades. They may not rightly know which convention you're following, or even expect there is a difference.

This can be confusing when different industries, assign different nominal sizes to a size that is dimensionally the exact same. The fence industry speaks in terms of approximate OD (or interchangeably, exact OD), while plumbing and electrical speak in terms of approximate ID. For instance, a 2 1/2" fence post is the same thing as a 2 3/8" fence post, and is dimensionally the same as a 2" schedule 40 plumbing pipe.