Lamp Replacement on Energized Fixture

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wasasparky

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I believe OSHA (&70E) would require you to de-energize the fixture...

Let's say fixture is out (assume HID), nearby fixtures are circuited on same switchleg, manager doesn't want to shut them all down...

Our policy will be to de-energize. Just interested in comments on experiences, real danger, what is common in "real life" (you know - what the other guys do...), etc.

Troubleshooting by qualified people can involve measuring open circuit voltage, but replacing a burnt out lamp may be a stretch to call troubleshooting...
 
wasasparky said:
Just interested in comments on experiences, real danger, what is common in "real life" (you know - what the other guys do...), etc.
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I've had to work on 277v. lighting live all day because you "can't" shut down the customer. You know it's not safe. Is it common? Probably.
 
physis said:
I've had to work on 277v. lighting live all day because you "can't" shut down the customer. You know it's not safe. Is it common? Probably.
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I have done the same thing for many years, We did start installing an inline fuse at each fixture so the next guy to get the job could just remove the fuse do the work and replace the fuse and be on their way.

Charlie
 
physis said:
I've had to work on 277v. lighting live all day because you "can't" shut down the customer. You know it's not safe. Is it common? Probably.
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neutral said:
I have done the same thing for many years, We did start installing an inline fuse at each fixture so the next guy to get the job could just remove the fuse do the work and replace the fuse and be on their way.

Charlie
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Two fine examples of why 70E enforcement is needed.
 
When I re-lamp hi-bay lights in a warehouse or similar place, I leave the lights on as I drive the lift around and replace lamps as needed. Then I'll turn the power off to replace ballasts ( unless plug and cord connected).
When I re-lamp parking lots I mark the bad poles with a piece of tape, then turn the power off before going up in the bucket.
 
I relamp and check open circuit voltage hot. I remember, or mark the fixtures with bad ballasts and shut them down. If manager doesn't like it, oh well, I'm not taking apart some nasty 277v hid light with crunchy wirenuts and cracked insulation while it's hot just to make him happy! Sounds like a good time to install some of those little orange fixture disconnects so next time they can stay powered up, just pull the disco apart. Maybe that'll keep him happy.:rolleyes:
 
This is interesting we are discussing this issue at work. as there is a public safety factor involved with shuting down lights here. we can drop the contactor on individual lights which still leaves one leg live. cost to rewire is very high and not in budget. so live is necessary. :smile:
 
Cow said:
and shut them down. If manager doesn't like it, oh well, I'm not taking apart some nasty 277v hid light with crunchy wirenuts and cracked insulation while it's hot just to make him happy!
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I'm presuming you're talking about the customer's manager. Not to say that they don't have some significant influence but my trouble with this sort of thing is the contractor happily climbing on board and all but forcing their employees to operate under these conditions.

I've been expected to not only do this all hot but also work faster than humanly possible, as if it's not unsafe enough yet. And forget about hazard pay.

Edit: Error A
 
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JES2727 said:
When I re-lamp hi-bay lights in a warehouse or similar place, I leave the lights on as I drive the lift around and replace lamps as needed. Then I'll turn the power off to replace ballasts ( unless plug and cord connected).
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Let's just consider replacing a burnt out lamp on an energized HID fixture.
Is it still required to de-energize for lamp change only?
It appears common to relamp hot...then de-energize if you need to dig into the fixture...
 
wasasparky said:
Let's just consider replacing a burnt out lamp on an energized HID fixture.
Is it still required to de-energize for lamp change only?
It appears common to relamp hot...then de-energize if you need to dig into the fixture...
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I think only qualified personel have to cut power to change a bulb, everyone else can just pretty much change the bulb.
 
Per OSHA 1910.333(a)(1), live parts to which an employee may be exposed must be de-energized before the employee works on or near them, unless the employer can demonstrate that de-energizing introduces additional or increased hazards or is not feasible due to equipment design or operational limitations. (Live parts that operate at less than 50 volts to ground need not be de-energized if there will be no increased exposure to electrical burns or to explosion due to electric arcs.)
 
dougmac said:
Per OSHA 1910.333(a)(1), live parts to which an employee may be exposed must be de-energized before the employee works on or near them, unless the employer can demonstrate that de-energizing introduces additional or increased hazards or is not feasible due to equipment design or operational limitations. (Live parts that operate at less than 50 volts to ground need not be de-energized if there will be no increased exposure to electrical burns or to explosion due to electric arcs.)
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What about1910.333(a)(1)(Note 1)?
Note 1: Examples of increased or additional hazards include interruption of life support equipment, deactivation of emergency alarm systems, shutdown of hazardous location ventilation equipment, or removal of illumination for an area.

If a procedure is developed, then we are ok?
 
wasasparky said:
What about1910.333(a)(1)(Note 1)?
Note 1: Examples of increased or additional hazards include interruption of life support equipment, deactivation of emergency alarm systems, shutdown of hazardous location ventilation equipment, or removal of illumination for an area.

If a procedure is developed, then we are ok?
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First whatever excuse you decide to use to be able to work live ask yourself how legitimate will it sound if someone dies?

Now assuming you have to do it live then you would have to have the right PPE on.
 
iwire said:
First whatever excuse you decide to use to be able to work live ask yourself how legitimate will it sound if someone dies?

Now assuming you have to do it live then you would have to have the right PPE on.
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Let's not get too excited here...:cool:
I don't agree with the gloom and doom - someone gonna die thing.
I want to do the right thing, but not limit what CAN be done if there are ways...
You assume some risk just driving to the site, going up the lift,...
I'll pause here before I get excited:rolleyes:

I'm just trying to learn real requirements, risks, practices, etc.
(Not trying to get way with anything, qualified people do the work)
 
physis said:
I'm presuming you're talking about the customer's manager. Not to say that they don't have some significant influence but my trouble with this sort of thing is the contractor happily climbing on board and all but forcing their employees to operate under these conditions.

I've been expected to not only do this all hot but also work faster than humanly possible, as if it's not unsafe enough yet. And forget about hazard pay.
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Some of our guys choose to work some things hot. Our SOP for low bays is cord and plug on new installs. So 90% of the time we get out of it just by unplugging the light. I've worked on lighting circuits in all of the plants we maintain. I usually have no issues other than scheduling. I'm not going to lie, if it's inconvenient for me, I'll take apart a 120v light hot, very very seldom do I take apart a 277v though. I've heard too many stories of guys getting hung up to take that chance all the time. Does my boss expect me to do lights hot? I'm not sure, I just do what I feel is comfortably safe for me.
 
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