Learning a lot about generators, but there's one thing that's a thorn in my side.

Status
Not open for further replies.
jaylectricity

jaylectricity

Senior Member
Location
Massachusetts
Occupation
licensed journeyman electrician
I've been working on my own with my license since 2002. Up until last year I had wired up maybe 2 generators, both portable with one of those Reliance transfer switches with the six circuits.

In the last year or so I've wired up 20 generators with automatic transfer switches. Almost all of them in one town with a particular inspector who I don't dislike, but he's been bothering me lately.

To me, I show up to wire up the generator, and I figure out where the meter is, where the panel is, and how to redirect the service entrance or feeder cables, etc.

But on inspection the inspector calls out clearances from "combustible materials" and "openings into the home".

The first time he did this I said, "You're in effect, failing my installation for something that has nothing to do with the NEC other than 'manufacturer recommendations'." My issue mainly being I don't want the contractor to think that I can't pass the inspection.

Never mind that the only heat generated from a Generac is from the exhaust, which you can stick your hand in front of for any length of time without burning it.
 
He's had several questions about some installs. But since this all started he's passed several, so it's not a vendetta or anything. My contractor wants to think so because he's relatively new in town and my inspector (who owns and operates an electrical contracting business in town) might be upset about the competition.
 
jaylectricity said:
But on inspection the inspector calls out clearances from "combustible materials" and "openings into the home".
Click to expand...

Both of these things are real concerns. You don't want some insurance company saying you are liable for a house fire because the exhaust was blowing next to combustible materials regardless of how hot it is. And you definitely don't want to be notified that a family died of carbon monoxide poisoning because the gennie was too close to a window.
 
You have to follow the NEC and the required building codes.

Why do you think lighting packages nowadays have all the daylight harvesting, occ sensors, etc? From what I've seen, the NEC could care less about saving energy. It's building code requirements. You still have to follow them.

You can keep fighting it, or you can choose to read up on it to become better educated so you fully understand the requirements you are to abide by.
 
Don't get me wrong...I'm not fighting it. I'm just perturbed that it's my inspection that fails even though it's not anything I did.

I told the contractor, the electrical inspector is there to make sure I don't do a dangerous installation, so if I wire up something that will be dangerous it's going to fail.

My real problem is with the contractor, I guess. And I don't see the plumbing inspector failing the job because the plumber piped in something that will be dangerous. And I don't see the building inspector failing the platform built when he knows it's for a generator.

I'm going to have to just refuse to wire it up until I know it's in a proper placement.
 
Just some thoughts :
  • You should follow manufacturer's recommendations. In most cases they are based on common sense and they are also looking to cover their butts.
  • Logical things like locate the generator at least 5' from any window, 5' away from anything combustible are sensible recommendations and EI's can hang their hats on those.
  • Not sure how it works up in MA but here in NJ an EC can be an EI but not within the same town his business address is in or in neighboring towns (I think it used to be 50 miles of his address years ago)
  • Another thing is that you should try to locate the unit as close as possible to a point where the NG piping can be run easily. In most cases it's a lot easier for us to run the electric lines in than for the plumber to install gas lines.
Good luck with this.
 
This is my concern.

jaylectricity said:
and my inspector (who owns and operates an electrical contracting business in town) might be upset about the competition.
Click to expand...

Granted, I have only worked in areas where the inspectors are governmental employees be it city, county, or state, but to be inspected by a fellow contractor just seems absurd IMO.

Roger
 
roger said:
This is my concern.



Granted, I have only worked in areas where the inspectors are governmental employees be it city, county, or state, but to be inspected by a fellow contractor just seems absurd IMO.

Roger
Click to expand...
I did a trailer service in the neighboring county years ago, the inspector was also a contractor. Don’t know if it’s still the same way.
Down at the boss’s farm in South Georgia, the county inspector is also a contractor.
 
Cow said:
You have to follow the NEC and the required building codes.

Why do you think lighting packages nowadays have all the daylight harvesting, occ sensors, etc? From what I've seen, the NEC could care less about saving energy. It's building code requirements. You still have to follow them.

You can keep fighting it, or you can choose to read up on it to become better educated so you fully understand the requirements you are to abide by.
Click to expand...

I agree.
 
Eddie702 said:
I am in MA. as well. As far as I know an inspector can not work in the city/town he inspects in
Click to expand...

Take a little trip down to Hull, MA. He's been inspecting and also one of the largest contractors in town for 30 years. He can't inspect his own work, obviously. And if he bids a job and doesn't get it, he can't inspect the job. The neighboring Hingham inspector does.
 
I just took the online Generac generator class for installation. It was conveyed to us that we as the installers are responsible for generator placement. We also have the responsibility to inform our pipefitter gas man of the requirements for a pipe sizing. There’s been cases were even the meter gas meter is
250 K BTU .Which is an undersized gas meter. This case we would have to inform the pipefitter and gas utility to upgrade the gas meter to 420k BTU.
There’s a lot of responsibility when it comes to generator installation and ultimately it falls on the electrical contractor.If the homeowner or GC has a preference that conflicts with the requirements then we inform them of what the requirements are. That statement may not apply to every situation but it sure applies to a lot of them


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Peter Furrow said:
I just took the online Generac generator class for installation. It was conveyed to us that we as the installers are responsible for generator placement. We also have the responsibility to inform our pipefitter gas man of the requirements for a pipe sizing. There’s been cases were even the meter gas meter is
250 K BTU .Which is an undersized gas meter. This case we would have to inform the pipefitter and gas utility to upgrade the gas meter to 420k BTU.
There’s a lot of responsibility when it comes to generator installation and ultimately it falls on the electrical contractor.If the homeowner or GC has a preference that conflicts with the requirements then we inform them of what the requirements are. That statement may not apply to every situation but it sure applies to a lot of them


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Generac needs to send their salesman through the school too, we installed a bunch of them for a big box store, and over half of them required a meter upgrade that the customer was not told about. They would say they could run bigger loads than they were capable of too.
 
hillbilly1 said:
I did a trailer service in the neighboring county years ago, the inspector was also a contractor. Don’t know if it’s still the same way.
Down at the boss’s farm in South Georgia, the county inspector is also a contractor.
Click to expand...

Where in South Georgia exactly ?

The previous chief elec inspector in Thomasville was also an EC, but he’s since quit the inspection gig. He and I had some major head butting about what he wanted vs what the code required that ended up with the state stepping in.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
brantmacga said:
Where in South Georgia exactly ?

The previous chief elec inspector in Thomasville was also an EC, but he’s since quit the inspection gig. He and I had some major head butting about what he wanted vs what the code required that ended up with the state stepping in.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Taylor county, I don't know if he is still doing it, this was several years ago.
 
Peter Furrow said:
I just took the online Generac generator class for installation. It was conveyed to us that we as the installers are responsible for generator placement. We also have the responsibility to inform our pipefitter gas man of the requirements for a pipe sizing. There’s been cases were even the meter gas meter is
250 K BTU .Which is an undersized gas meter. This case we would have to inform the pipefitter and gas utility to upgrade the gas meter to 420k BTU.
There’s a lot of responsibility when it comes to generator installation and ultimately it falls on the electrical contractor.If the homeowner or GC has a preference that conflicts with the requirements then we inform them of what the requirements are. That statement may not apply to every situation but it sure applies to a lot of them


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...
Only if you are supplying and setting the generator or it's otherwise part of your contract. Preferably your written contract, or at least a work order that spells these things out. Otherwise, these details are on the GC.
 
Then there was the time, right before Christmas, that we were performing load bank testing of 4 paralleled 500kW generators located in the basement of a large office building. The exhausts were placed 2 stories above street level. Belched thick sooty black smoke with large load steps. Across the street from the Denver Center For Performing Arts. Patrons were not pleased, as they exited from a show in their finest, to face a cloud of smoke.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top