Lets have some fun.

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southernboys#2

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Just read something interesting in the nec codebook. I realize its just one mans opinion. However in a twisted way it makes sense. If there are no exceptions to receptacles in a bathroom needing gfci protection. How is it that we dont put the exhaust fan on the gfci circuit. Like I said lets have some fun.
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

Portable appliances are no plugged into the fan. The intent is to gfci protect what ever is plugged into the receptacle.

romeo
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

Whats to stop someone from unpluging the fan and plugging in a hair blower ? This is not about intent but rather what it says.If we say its in the bathroom then it can't be exempt.
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

How about the fact it is not a 15 amp or 20 amp rated receptacle?

It is probably rated in watts not amps, think about the 16 or 18 AWG pigtails on the back side of these 'receptacles'.
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

Originally posted by jimwalker:
True Bob,but how does that stop it from being used ? And it's configuration is that of a non grounded 15 amp.
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Jim I don't think the one for a fan is polarized so a standard plug might not fit in.

But nothing stops a fool on mission. :D
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

The receptacle inside the fan is not a receptacle, It is part of listed piece of equipment. The code does not apply to internal wiring of appliances. JMO.
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

Originally posted by southernboys#2:
I aint no ones fool.
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No one is saying you are. :)

Originally posted by southernboys#2:
Is it not a plug that requires 15 amp wire to make it work?
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At a minimum yes.

However as this device is not rated 15 or 20 amps you can not call it a receptacle and connect it to a 15 or 20 amp branch circuit.

That would be a violation of 210.21(A)(3)

In the end IMO jes25 has the answer.

Originally posted by jes25:
The receptacle inside the fan is not a receptacle, It is part of listed piece of equipment. The code does not apply to internal wiring of appliances. JMO.
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Re: Lets have some fun.

As Joe has mentioned, the receptacle of the fan is part of a listed item. Therefore it is not a bathroom receptacle.

That being said, it will not stop a person who is determined to use the receptacle if the bath receptacle is not working. I have seen worse things than that before.
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

What's to stop a homeowner from using one of those screw in receptacles in the light fixture above the sink?

Bob
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

When I started typing this comment, I had planned to play along on southernboys-2's side for a while. But before I finished typing, I had talked myself into supporting those who had said that 210.8 did not apply to the fan's receptacle.

Presuming there is a receptacle attached to, and a component part of, the ceiling fan, then that receptacle is not, by the NEC's definition, a "receptacle." Look at the Article 100 definition of "receptacle," and take special note that it contains the word "at."
A receptacle is a contact device installed at the outlet for the connection of an attachment plug.
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So is the fan's receptacle installed "at the outlet"? You must look at the definition of "outlet."
A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment.
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So you connect the fan's supply wires to the premises wiring system. At that point, you are not longer at the outlet. Internal to the equipment, there are wires that connect to what looks to all the world like a receptacle. But that (apparent) receptacle is not installed at the outlet, so it does not meet the NEC's definition of receptacle. Therefore, 210.8 would not require it to be GFCI protected.

QED
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

"A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment."

So if this receptacle is not for taking current then why is it even there.It very much so will use current.As to it being hard to use it,i need no tools to pop that cover off and simply unplug that fan.Your going to say what fool would do that.The same fool that plugs an exstintion cord into the G D O outlet in the garage.
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

Jim, if you are that determined to use this for your hair dryer go for it. :D

Roger
 
Re: Lets have some fun.

The same fool that plugs an exstintion cord into the G D O outlet in the garage.
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There's always room for "Murphy". After years of inspecting, I recently went to a job which had been granted "temporary power" on the service.
A three car garage had 9 GFCI protected outlets, all readily accessible, and one non-GFCI duplex about 6 ft aff with the central vac plugged into it. A carpeneter was using a table saw outside, shortly after a rain, with an extension cord plugged into the spare space in the duplex. After an explaination, I also thanked him for giving me the ammunition for my enforcement of 210.8 (A)2 Ex 2 for all these years. Only wished I had my camera for more documentation for all the electricians that say "why does that have to be a single outlet"
 
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