License to install conduit?

[ibew441dc]

Dan we have disagreed on this - but the law creating the regulation is not the same as the regulation wording, and it is the regulation wording is what counts.... While California's "Electrician Certification" is still in it's infancy (some of us have kids older than this law") the rules are still being written and rewritten. The intent was never to allow anyone to do electrical work short of changing a lightbulb.... :grin: It actually took these morons several years to realize that most telephone systems are over 100VA....

For the record...the only thing I really did not agree on was the available posted CEU stuff at the beginning. It is obvious to me that you have spent way more time with the structure and maturity of this topic.....but that being said, I was pointing out the abuse of screwed up language, and you were defending its legitimate intent:smile:

e57, and to all CA electricians......I am not promoting GC's, Labororers, Hacks, ect. to install raceways always intended for electricians......I mean common:roll: I am a die hard electrician who thinks if one is not an "electrician",formal or informally trained, and ultimately not certified or licensed , then you are not an electrician, and shouldn't be messing with the stuff.
I am merely adding to the conversation, by providing an example of unintended unlicensed people who think running a piece of conduit is as easy as gluing 2 pieces together or turning a wrench. IMO potentially very dangerous.

On the other hand some states do not have a license structure or anything like that....ultimately it comes back to IMO the incomplete definition of a qualified person in the NEC. It should say if one has never heard of the NEC then they probably aren't an electrician:grin:...

 

[ibew441dc]

Dan and Mark, please do not derail this thread, you guys already have CA licensing threads in progress or you can start another.

Don't worry, not our intention to derail the thread.....

I just wanted to point out an applicable example from our neck of the woods:smile:

Many of the facts that both e57 and myself have posted here and on other threads (weather we agree or disagree)are directly related to this thread.

That all I have to say about thhaaaaatt!:grin: (Forest Gump)

 

[iMuse97]

I agree with the others. No self respecting electrician would let the GC run any conduit.:-? Digging a trench is fine.

Just my dittos. I sometimes don't even like to pull wire in runs when other electricians installed them, much less if some clueless jmoke "ran pipe," as they call it. And yes, I don't mind at all if someone else digs. I'll be doing my own digging in about 8 hours, and am glad it's only 25' in recently disturbed earth.

 

[Rockyd]

Maybe the GC has an electrician who can do it.

If the GC tries to pull this off, SUE HIM. You are the EC of record, and responsible for the electrical on the job, I'm sure you wouldn't want to cover a clown.

 

[e57]

Don't worry, not our intention to derail the thread.....

I just wanted to point out an applicable example from our neck of the woods:smile:

Many of the facts that both e57 and myself have posted here and on other threads (weather we agree or disagree)are directly related to this thread.

That all I have to say about thhaaaaatt!:grin: (Forest Gump)

I sent you a PM - Apparently the CSLB will sort it out.... ?????

 

[yucan2]

Recently here in my neck of the woods I was contracted by the local utility to install (2) underground, heavy wall, 4" conduits, encased in concrete. Why encased in concrete? That's another thread.

Anyway, as is often the case with customers and utilities the scope of the work changed. Conduit now 10 feet from the optimum location through no fault of ours.

Now the fun begins. While now working inside the structure on tenant improvements, unrelated to the utility run, I noticed from a window, 4 or 5 guys preparing to dig a trench right where my newly installed conduits were buried. I inquired what was up? They stated that they worked for the utility and were instructed to dig down too some concrete encased conduits. Then they were too jackhammer the concrete to expose the conduit and reroute the pipe.

I said you gotta be joking? They stated that they were laborers but experts at this particular task.

I immediately walked away and called the department of electrical inspection and was told this: The utility is an entity in and of itself. With the exception of their entrance lobby at any of their public facilities that are likely to encounter public pedestrian traffic, we have no jurisdiction. They can pretty much do whatever and hire whomever they choose.

Sounded somewhat incredulous to me, so I called my local union hall and was told essentially the same thing.

So, moving right along, I decided to watch these "experts". They jack hammered down too and into the conduits. First one, then the other. Being as what they exposed was now useless, they sawzalled until they could get a concentric enough section that would allow them to slip over a PVC sleeve/coupling/something. They split it getting it on. Then they brought out a myriad of PVC bends. 30 deg., 45 deg., and 90's. They then began cutting to create the ugliest and sharpest offset on such a large conduit that I have ever seen. They ended up needing 2 of these contraptions.

I'm sorry for the long post, but I'm not done.

The utility shows up a few days later to pull their cables. This is priceless. They had to use a tugger to pull in the rope!!! This was only a 150 ft. run. One of the utility guys turns to me and asks how many bends do you have in this pipe. Well sir, there were 2-90's, but now ....

Next day, time to pull cable. 2 anchors on rear of tugger in vault, literally pull out of the concrete. Had to rig pole to the ceiling to keep tugger stationary. Pull took all day.

Summary. I got paid. The so-called "experts" got paid. Building went on-line.

Think I'll go take another 32 CEU's and grab another certification or 2 so the "experts" can continue to do our work. Go figure.

 

[jeremysterling]

I'm in the finishing stages of installing sidewalk ductbanks for the city's use. These are conduits for street lights and traffic signals. The GC'c has been great, digging my trenches, chipping out old concrete, and providing grade for 13 handholes (17" X 30" flared wall). The GC even set the 2 manholes for the project.

The GC respects our ability to install these conduits. The city inspector has liked what he's seen so far.

Like the previous poster's story, these conduits are supposed to have only 2 90? bends. Seems only electricians understand that.

I agree with most of the responses. Let the GC trench and the EC install the conduit.

 

[monkey]

I would be surprised if anyone here would use a conduit system installed by a GC. Let them trench, fine, but no way would I finish a job started by someone else.

How about the ones who wire their own additions then try to get an electrician to do the "hookup". Yeah sure buddy I'll hook it up for you and be totally responsible for all of it just give me an hours pay, yeah that will be worth it, I can hardly wait.

 

[PetrosA]

Never again...

Never again...

I was at a job site two years ago, in a sort of de facto head electrician position when the GC and owner came and told me the excavator was going to be ready the next day for a short run (maybe 50') of 1 1/4" PVC for three pole lights. I said ok, I'd let my boss know to bring material the next day. We get there in the morning, and the guy has the trench backfilled already, with 1 1/4" WHITE PLUMBING PVC - one pipe sticking up at each location! I said, Please don't tell me you used T connectors down below... Sure 'nuff...

I passed that one right back to my boss

 

[petersonra]

I was at a job site two years ago, in a sort of de facto head electrician position when the GC and owner came and told me the excavator was going to be ready the next day for a short run (maybe 50') of 1 1/4" PVC for three pole lights. I said ok, I'd let my boss know to bring material the next day. We get there in the morning, and the guy has the trench backfilled already, with 1 1/4" WHITE PLUMBING PVC - one pipe sticking up at each location! I said, Please don't tell me you used T connectors down below... Sure 'nuff...

I passed that one right back to my boss

I did some work for a customer whose electricians routinely used black iron elbows instead of conduit ells. I asked about it once. the head electrician said after they painted the conduit it would look the same anyway.