Light Switches Near Showers

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hae

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Is there a code requirement for light switch distance from a shower? I have a shower with a compact fluorescent downlight (shower lens - drop opal) and I need to know if there is a distance limitation. Also, does it change requirements with a stainless steel coverplate?

Thanks,

HAE
 
Take a look at 404.4, The last sentence says:

"Switches shall not be installed within wet locations in tub or shower spaces unless installed as part of a listed tub or shower assembly."

Chris
 
Grab a level and make a vertical line from the edge of the tub or shower.If the switch doesn`t encroach this area it is code compliant.Do I agree, NO.Does my opinion make a difference NO !!!!!
 
allenwayne said:
Grab a level and make a vertical line from the edge of the tub or shower.If the switch doesn`t encroach this area it is code compliant.Do I agree, NO.Does my opinion make a difference NO !!!!!
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Why do you not agree? You can install a switch outside correct? it rains outside last time I checked...
 
stickboy1375 said:
Why do you not agree? You can install a switch outside correct? it rains outside last time I checked...
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Yes You CAN install the switch outside the shower, do I think it is a safe place for it to be there NO......Guess it`s just that a switch and standing in a tub of water or in a shower gives me the willies when the two are used together.
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
We can and do install receptacles outside.Does that mean i can put one in the shower ? No
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where did receptacles come from? we are talking about switches... my point was since no one got the point was, HOW come its a ISSUE to install a switch NEAR a SHOWER, but nobody has a problem installing one OUTSIDE??? IS THERE A DIFFERENCE? besides being naked....(hopefully)
 
stickboy1375 said:
my point was since no one got the point was, HOW come its a ISSUE to install a switch NEAR a SHOWER, but nobody has a problem installing one OUTSIDE???
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Who says I don't have a problem installing a switch outside?

If I install a switch outside it will be weatherproof, check 404.4.
 
stickboy1375 said:
where did receptacles come from? we are talking about switches... my point was since no one got the point was, HOW come its a ISSUE to install a switch NEAR a SHOWER, but nobody has a problem installing one OUTSIDE??? IS THERE A DIFFERENCE? besides being naked....(hopefully)
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If a switch is safe then why would a receptacle not be.I personally dont think its a smart location for either receptacle or switches.We would never let you put a receptacle or switch within reach of a hot tub but its fine with a metal bath tub.Why !!!!!!!!!!!
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
If a switch is safe then why would a receptacle not be.I personally dont think its a smart location for either receptacle or switches.We would never let you put a receptacle or switch within reach of a hot tub but its fine with a metal bath tub.Why !!!!!!!!!!!
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Yeh, the hottub issue probably has to do with bonding, but the bathtub/shower switch location has to do with water entering the switch box... the code is protecting the switch, not the operator, the reason I believe this is that your allowed to install a switch outside with a weatherproof cover, hence to keep moisture out.....again nothing to protect against shock... otherwise it would have to be on gfi protected circuit... IMO.. any thoughts...
 
Now what kind of weatherproof cover are you using makes a difference.We went through this awhile back and it was determined that only a weatherproof cover designed specifically for a switch or an in use cover were able to be used.

Even though like a weather proof single device cover has the cut out in the flap for a toggle switch,like a T&B WR74C . It is listed as a receptacle cover and not to be used on a toggle switch.
 
allenwayne said:
Now what kind of weatherproof cover are you using makes a difference.We went through this awhile back and it was determined that only a weatherproof cover designed specifically for a switch or an in use cover were able to be used.

Even though like a weather proof single device cover has the cut out in the flap for a toggle switch,like a T&B WR74C . It is listed as a receptacle cover and not to be used on a toggle switch.
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I would only use whats approved for a switch... does anyone have some pics of newer weather proof switch covers?
 
stickboy1375 said:
Yeh, the hottub issue probably has to do with bonding, but the bathtub/shower switch location has to do with water entering the switch box... the code is protecting the switch, not the operator, the reason I believe this is that your allowed to install a switch outside with a weatherproof cover, hence to keep moisture out.....again nothing to protect against shock... otherwise it would have to be on gfi protected circuit... IMO.. any thoughts...
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I dont like or agree with this reasoning at all.

As per the OP, I agree with those memebers who are concerned about "saftey".

That should always be first.

IMO, dont install a switch there, and if installed where a person is going to stand "dripping wet" on a conductive/grounded surface to operate said switch

Then install a GFCI device upstream. I dont care about an occasional nuisance trip, if any.

But I sure as xxxx care about someone getting shocked.

404.9 : 2005 with some commentary.

404.9 Provisions for General-Use Snap Switches
(A) Faceplates Faceplates provided for snap switches mounted in boxes and other enclosures shall be installed so as to completely cover the opening and, where the switch is flush mounted, seat against the finished surface.

(B) Grounding Snap switches, including dimmer and similar control switches, shall be effectively grounded and shall provide a means to ground metal faceplates, whether or not a metal faceplate is installed. Snap switches shall be considered effectively grounded if either of the following conditions is met:

(1) The switch is mounted with metal screws to a metal box or to a nonmetallic box with integral means for grounding devices.

(2) An equipment grounding conductor or equipment bonding jumper is connected to an equipment grounding termination of the snap switch.
Exception to (B): Where no grounding means exists within the snap-switch enclosure or where the wiring method does not include or provide an equipment ground, a snap switch without a grounding connection shall be permitted for replacement purposes only. A snap switch wired under the provisions of this exception and located within reach of earth, grade, conducting floors, or other conducting surfaces shall be provided with a faceplate of nonconducting, noncombustible material or shall be protected by a ground-fault circuit interrupter.

The exception to 404.9(B) was expanded in the 2005 Code to require GFCI protection for the circuits terminating in an ungrounded device box where a metal faceplate is installed and it can be touched by persons in contact with a grounded surface. This exception provides additional safety to persons where older electrical installations did not provide an equipment grounding conductor in the wiring method.

The provisions of 404.9(B) specify that switching devices, including snap switches, dimmers, and similar control devices, must be grounded. Although the non–current-carrying metal parts of these devices typically are not subject to contact by personnel, there is concern about the use of metal faceplates, which do pose a shock hazard if they become energized. Therefore, the switch must provide a means for connection of an equipment grounding conductor to ground the metal faceplate if one is installed.

The requirements in 404.9(B)(1) or 404.9(B)(2) describe the provisions to satisfy the main requirement. Switch plates in existing installations attached to switches in boxes without an equipment grounding conductor must be made of insulating material. See Exhibit 404.1, following the commentary in 404.12, for an example of the typical method by which a metal faceplate is grounded. Section 404.9(B)(2) was revised to clarify that the metal yoke of the device, where in direct contact with a grounded metal device box, serves to adequately ground the yoke, thereby grounding the faceplate.
 
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I understand everybodys view on safety first, BUT if the NEC was worried so much about it then why not a 5' rule for a switch near a tub, it really must not be an issue according to the nec... my whole point was " whats the difference between outside install and near a shower install, the weatherproof cover for an outside location only protects the switch not the operator... sooooo how can someone disagree with a switch outside a shower but not a switch installed outside...? you can't have your cake and eat it too....
 
stickboy1375 said:
I understand everybodys view on safety first, BUT if the NEC was worried so much about it then why not a 5' rule for a switch near a tub, it really must not be an issue according to the nec... my whole point was " whats the difference between outside install and near a shower install, the weatherproof cover for an outside location only protects the switch not the operator... sooooo how can someone disagree with a switch outside a shower but not a switch installed outside...? you can't have your cake and eat it too....
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Do you mean "in" the shower or "near" the shower. There is a switch near my shower for the closet light. The difference between it and an outdoor switch is that one is a wet location and one a dry location.

If you're asking "why is it ok to have an outdoor switch in a wet location but not a switch in a shower", I don't have the answer.

edit:typo
 
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j_erickson said:
Do you mean "in" the shower or "near" the shower. There is a switch near my shower for the closet light. The difference between it and an outdoor switch is that one is a wet location and one a dy location.

If you're asking "why is it ok to have an outdoor switch in a wet location but not a switch in a shower", I don't have the answer.
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no not in the shower, outside the shower area, People are worried you can flip a switch while still in the shower, yet I say you can be outside in a rainstorm and still flip a switch so whats the difference... thats all no biggie..

I don't want people thinking I install without reason, I'm just pointing out what code says you are allowed... and trying to justify the codes reason... and my point is, without reflection on how I wire, is that code is only protecting the switch in a wet location....
 
stickboy1375 said:
no not in the shower, outside the shower area, People are worried you can flip a switch while still in the shower, yet I say you can be outside in a rainstorm and still flip a switch so whats the difference... thats all no biggie..
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That doesn't bother me.
 
stickboy1375 said:
I would only use whats approved for a switch... does anyone have some pics of newer weather proof switch covers?
Click to expand...

How about this one?

E98TSCN-CAR.jpg
 
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