Lighting Outlet Revisited

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Well Ground

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After reading every post of the most-visited thread of last month, I have to say I'm still not sure what to do for this one.

In a nutshell, I'm bidding a large custom home, and in each of the six bedrooms and two balcony/lanais the plans have two switches (or three ways in the case of the double-entranced lanais) leading only to the fan.

It looks ridiculous, to me. If you're paying this high, get creative with your lighting. Regardless...

Obviously, the architect/builder believes the ceiling fan light kit satisfies the code requirements for luminairies in a room. Normally I'd just bid a switched receptacle in each and a coach/recessed on the lanai and call it a day, and let them duke it out in the field. However, this is a first plan from a new builder for my company, so I'd like to 1. minimize my questions to the builder to important ones 2. bid accurately yet profitable; competition is tight.

Any suggestions would be very welcome. :idea:

Matt
Estimator
 
I would bid the minimum to keep the price down. After you get the job, then go and discuss other options. Since this is a custom home, I would venture a guess they will probably want some extra stuff, but maybe arn't aware of what they can do. (e.g. all women love undercabinet lights) Just be reasonable on the $extras$, one job doesn't make a career.
 
kingpb said:
I would bid the minimum to keep the price down. After you get the job, then go and discuss other options. Since this is a custom home, I would venture a guess they will probably want some extra stuff, but maybe arn't aware of what they can do. (e.g. all women love undercabinet lights) Just be reasonable on the $extras$, one job doesn't make a career.
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Women love 4-ways, too. Why have two switches when 3 or 4 are even more fun?

And, yeah, undercabinet lights are very cool. Gotta get me some of them :D
 
Well Ground said:
In a nutshell, I'm bidding a large custom home, and in each of the six bedrooms and two balcony/lanais the plans have two switches (or three ways in the case of the double-entranced lanais) leading only to the fan.
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I'm confused.

They've given you a set of plans, and you're puzzled whether you should bid something else that's not on the plans? I sure wouldn't. For all you know, the minimalist client and the architect may have struggled for days on the electrical switching and fixture arrangement. My advice... bid the plan now and ask questions later.
 
Having started the original thread, I'd like to say to avoid a problem I'd do the following

!. ask the inspector what he thinks (if you want)
2. if you dont want to do #1 and to CYA, run a 3 wire to the closest receptacle from the switch then you can hang the fan on the LIGHTING OUTLET and still have the option of how you want to wire that receptacle (1/2 switched or hot all the time)

I would like to restate that, using the NEC ,no fixture is required to be installe only the lighting outlet.
 
Start with the plans.If you start off saying the arch.has bad ideas he /she might not want your bid at any price.Extras are where the money is at.Once you start the job there is little they can do but pay what ever you want for changes.Start slamming wires then on day 2 suggest extras.
 
If they show 2 switches to the "fan", I'd assume the architect intends that both switches go to the box where the fan is being hung.

Or were you expecting to find a pair of dashed lines from the location of the switch on the plans to the ceiling fan's location in the center (or wherever) of the room?

What's the exact question?

Maybe a picture of the print for one of the rooms might help?
 
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mdshunk said:
They've given you a set of plans, and you're puzzled whether you should bid something else that's not on the plans? I sure wouldn't.
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Ditto.

For more advice on bidding customs, check out this recent thread. I'd say your topic is more along it's lines than "Lighting Outlet Revisited", as it seems all the required lighting outlets are present.

Your current thread title gave me a heart fibrillation. :D
 
georgestolz said:
Your current thread title gave me a heart fibrillation. :D
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I nearly shot myself.
icon9.gif
 
I can tell you from experience that when it comes to custom homes the only thing constant is changes !!!!!! Bid the job as per print and go from there.I always do a walk through with the homeowners especially the wife.They are the ones that spend the most time in the house and if momma ain`t happy ,nobody is happy :)

I had a woman ask me as we were doing a walk through.My husband wants a ceiling fan above the cook top on the center island did I think it was a good idea ?? My response,well if you fry alot it will get greasy.Without missing a beat she turned and said .Cook oh I don`t cook so I guess we will add it.This is in a kitchen that had over 40 running feet of counter and 2 islands drawer warmers the whole bit !!!!

Bid the base print don`t overthink it, the extras will come they always do in a custom home.I would avise setting up a meeting with the homeowners for a walk through.That way you can take a few hours and profit alot .The extras are where the money is.
 
allenwayne said:
I would avise setting up a meeting with the homeowners for a walk through.That way you can take a few hours and profit alot .The extras are where the money is.
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Amen, brother.

I converse with fellow contractors on other forums. I often hear things like, "I do little extras that set me apart", and "I always like to use xxx because it is better". I don't think these guys realize that they're shooting themselves in the foot. Bid the print, and win the job. After that, turn on your sales skills. You can bid a job at a loss, as if sometimes the case, and make out plenty good if you've spotted omissions in the prints and specs, and if you're reasonably good at upselling. Carry on.
 
Very Well!

Very Well!

Excellent input, thanks a lot for your suggestions.

I just bid to the prints and didn't worry about it, then faxed the proposal out early this (Mon.) morning. Maybe I was worrying too much about it. Didn't expect any word this early, but just a half an hour ago the P.O. came spittin' out with an immediate call about our bid and what we're looking at as far as starting work, so we got the job! But what kind of purchasing agent works at 8:00AM on a Monday...they are never available when you need them. Ah well.

High speed, low drag!

Thanks again gents.
 
Too low, maybe maybe maybe not.I`ve seen situations over the years that made me saw HUHHHHHHHH......After battling for almost a year on a job in an exclusive neighborhood we finally got paid by the homeowner the builder lost the entire job in court to the homeowner.Now he owns 4 other lots in the same cul de sac.So now he opens a builders group.What that is in essence is the members of the group buy the lot from him and he builds the houses for cost + 10%.The smallest one was 10,000 sq. ft.Oh by being the builder They can live in the house for 2 years and get a huge tax differal.
So they send over a set of plans,the estimator bids them higher than usual and gives the bid to the owner.He says I really don`t want to do his work.Just add 40 % to the bid !!!!! They never flinched,when can you guys start...... Remember the owner of the group gets cost + 10 %.........

So I was the one to wire them,did a walk through with the owner of the house and by the time we were done we had to recalculate the load and uped the service from 400 to 600 amps,the entire rebid doubled the original bid.Nobody flinched !!!!!! By the time I got done with the house the one next door was ready to wire.Same senario.High bid piles of extras and the PM about 10 min. into the walk through turns and says to me .Hey don`t they also need a 600 amp service !!!!!!

I spent 2 months on 1 cul de sac.I wired all 4 and trimmed them.This was right around christmas time and the christmas bonus was huge.So just because you bid a print don`t think that is all you`ll get.

Remeber in customs the only constant is change !!!!!!!!!!! Changes mean $$$$$$$$$,that`s where the money is in residential extras.......
 
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