Meter not on house

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G

GG

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Ft.Worth, T.X.
Hello, I went on a service call today to a 4000 sq. ft. house. The service panel was in the basement and was being fed underground from a meter base that was located 70' away from the house. The house was built in 1950. Would this installation meet tadays NEC requirements? I dont see how the fire men could ever find the meter if the house was on fire, as the meter wasnt even visable from the house. It took me 20 minutes just to find it.
 
Re: Meter not on house

The meter is not there for the firemen, it is there for the power co to measure the electricity. This is a typical installation around here on large homes with lots of land. Keeps the meter close to the street.
 
Re: Meter not on house

I know of no place in the NEC where it is required to locate a meter or service disconnect so firemen can find it? Education of firemen as to how to disrupt power feeding a building is a much better choice than to adding a high cost to builders and home owners. Even if codes like this were to be adopted by local AHJ's the firemen would still have to know this because of the many buildings and houses that would be still in existence. ;)

[ May 27, 2005, 06:22 PM: Message edited by: hurk27 ]
 
Re: Meter not on house

Originally posted by electricmanscott:
This is a typical installation around here on large homes with lots of land. Keeps the meter close to the street.
Click to expand...
The meter wasn't even close to the street. It was in the back yard of the house 200' from the street. What would keeing the meter close to the street accomplish?
 
Re: Meter not on house

We last year did a 5k sq/ft home with primary metering. The meter was on a pole about 1000' from the house.
Pedestal meters are also very, very common around here. Sometimes they are intentionally hidden. As long as the POCO signs off on the job it is good to go.
 
Re: Meter not on house

I have seen electric meters on the power pole in the far corner of the back yard. In newer homes, I've seen it out near the street for easy access to the meter reader.
As for the fire department, the main disconnect isn't even required to be outside, it may be immediately inside.
 
Re: Meter not on house

All this discussion brings to mind 230.66 ". . . Individual meter socket enclosures shall not be considered service equipment." :D
 
Re: Meter not on house

I wire very few new homes, but the ones I do are very high end. Most of the time they don't want the "ugly" meter anywhere on the house. It is often on the side of a detached garage, a pedestal somewhere in the bushes, or sometimes on a detached generator shack. If you're doing a very large home, you often have even bigger stuff to "hide" like CT cans and such, so putting the metering equipment somewhere other than on the house is very desirable for this type of customer. Between the electrician and the utility engineer, you should be able to find an acceptable place to "hide" the metering equipment.
 
Re: Meter not on house

Well I learn something new everyday. I dont know where I got it stuck in my head that the meter was allways put on the house.
 
Re: Meter not on house

I say the practice of pulling meters from houses in case of fire should be banned. The thought of a fireman pulling a C.T. meter and thinking it is safe to enter the dwelling is such a false security someone is going to get hurt, and if that C.T. can doesn't have a properly working shunt the one pulling the C.T. meter could be in for a big surprise. Costly solution have 911 register the POCO of each dwelling they serve and inform the emergency line crew to go to site and assist in disconnection. Here is a possible scenerio of a disaster, The house is already engulfed with flames the service is on the house the local fireman pulls the meter which is served overhead at that time the inferno has opened the roof at the mast the riser clamps have been removed by the siding company and never put back on the service in the house is fed with S.E.Cable so this live top lug that are exposed are now coming in contact with this fireman could be deadly. Just remember if the meter is on the house and in an emergency they pull the meter they will not put a glass blank cover and put the meter box cover back on. For street location to read meter it should have said utility right away as a meter reader has a right to cross the property on its right away without trespassing, So in street is that utilities right away in the 200 feet back house you have mentioned is that utilities right away.
 
Re: Meter not on house

Last July I was sent by my company To Oklahoma to wire a church that was to be built in 5 days We gt there and all there was ,was a slab and frame/truss pack.Local poco had a pole mounted combo meter/disc. about 145 ft away.By the time had the underground to the building it was up and sheathed.Day three we wired as the drwall was hung behind us ,day 4 energized the building.Day five bbq day 2,200 sq ft church done. :D
 
Re: Meter not on house

We just recently did a doctors office with a CT ,the MDP was in the middle of this building.In the event of a fire i wish them luck to go thru the maze to get to it even if they knowed where to look.Also did a private school with similar problems.Just what do the firemen do on buildings with a CT ? How safe is pulling a meter under a load ?
 
Re: Meter not on house

If it is a CT metered installation, pulling the meter does nothing except stop the meter and make the metering enclosure more dangerous with open CT secondaries. The only answer is to call the electric utility to pull the fuses that feed the transformer, if the firemen have to wait, so be it. :D
 
Re: Meter not on house

As already stated by others, pulling a meter should be not a standard used by the FD for removing power to a structure anyways and is not what it is for (see Scotts first post), that would be the reason for 230.70 through 230.72


Roger
 
Re: Meter not on house

Yes i know the meter will do nothing to stop power.In fact it is common here for poco to turn our service on before they install the meter,free electric for a day.Scary part is when the transformer sits on ground 5 feet from building.By the time poco arrives the building might very well be gone.Job security. ;)
 
Re: Meter not on house

Allenwayne,

There must not be any inspections in Oklahoma or did somebody pay the electrical inspector to stand around all day to inspect eah wire run as it was installed?

By the way, I am having a hard time finding out what the requirements are for getting a state license for Oklahoma. Can you send me a private message to tell me what they are?
 
Re: Meter not on house

Pulling a self contained meter to disconnect service is nowdays considered a serious safety hazard. The bypass in a lever bypass meter socket is not rated to break load and there have been some instances where the meter socket caught on fire.

First Energy requires horn bypass or lever bypass meter sockets so that they can change the meter without interrupting power OR stick a circuit breaker in place of the meter to do a disconnect.

If a self contained meter has more than about 40 amps at 120/240 volts going through it your are asking to get a flashover. 3 phase sockets are even worse because the jaws are so close together.
 
Re: Meter not on house

This was on indian /cheerokee nation land and they are exempt from the usual inspection process.32 people and 4 days and there was an up and running church :D
 
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