Meterbase combo, No main brk. ??? Inspector

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Buck Parrish

Buck Parrish

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NC & IN
I have used a 125amp meter base combo service panel. No Main
This panel I used to feed an existing 100 amp panel a 30 amp AC
And I installed two single pole 20's for wall outlets.

This panel's bus bar has 4 spaces, two spaces that you can not install half in. breaker. The other two spaces you are able to install 4, 1/2 in. breakers.
I used a 1 in. ea. 2 pole 100 amp , then four 1/2 in. ,togethet with the outside being the two pole 30 for the ac. The other two I used for two 1/2 in. single pole 20's, wall outlets.
I know that most panels with out a main you can not run the lighting or branch circuit out of it. But generally it will tell you on the panel cover.
Which I read and it said nothing about it.

I've not talked to the inspector but he left a message saying I could not use the 20's.
The way the panel is arranged you can turn every thing off with 6 motions.
And you can not put more spaces in it, It will only hold 2- 1 in. and either 2 more 1 in. or 4 -1/2 in. 6 total

My question is can I use it with 1 - 2 pole 100 amp breaker and four 1/2 in. one 2 pole 30 and two single pole 20's.
The inspector seems to be concerned with the 20's
 
This panel I used looks like it was made for this type of installation that I have used it on.
I know some panels where you can put more then six breakers you would not be allowed to use lighting or branch circuit.
Such as a 12-24. You could use that for a 6 -2 pole motions of the hand instead of the main, as long as it was rated for the ampacity you we're useing.
 
buckofdurham said:
This panel I used looks like it was made for this type of installation that I have used it on.
I know some panels where you can put more then six breakers you would not be allowed to use lighting or branch circuit.
Such as a 12-24. You could use that for a 6 -2 pole motions of the hand instead of the main, as long as it was rated for the ampacity you we're useing.
Click to expand...

I believe this install is compliant under the 2008 nec. It would not be under the 2005 NEC. Perhaps the inspector is not aware of the change== or more probably I am wrong. :grin:
 
buckofdurham said:
I will simplify the question.
Can you intall six breakers is a panel with no main.
2- 2 pole breakers and 2 single poles?
Click to expand...

Why not four two poles and two single poles?
IMHO either would be fine under the 08
 
buckofdurham said:
I will simplify the question.
Can you intall six breakers is a panel with no main.
2- 2 pole breakers and 2 single poles?
Click to expand...


I can't find a code reference to show the inspector.
May be I'll buy him lunch.

I ussually go by what is wrote on the panel it self. Some will say when used as a service panel no lighting or branch circuits allowed.
That is so you won't put more then six two pole breakers.

This panel you can not put more then six breakers single or two pole.
 
I would think that Section 230.71 would cover it. IMHO it would not matter how many breakers the panel could hold as long as you don't have more than six operations of the hand at the time of inspection. He should not be inspecting on "what if" or "somebody could" . Someone with a lot more knowledge then me will probably chime in.

Edit to add: This is if you are under the 2008.
 
glene77is said:
Check 408.36.A.
I think the inspector is correct.
Click to expand...

Buck is from NC and we are under the 2008 NEC. The section with lighting and appliance branch panelboards has been done away with.
 
I think he is good to go in 2008

408.36 Exception No. 1 Individual protection shall not be required for a panelboard used as service equipment with multiple disconnecting means in accordance with 230.71. In panelboards protected by three or more main circuit breakers or sets of fuses the circuit breakers or sets of fuses shall not supply a second bus structure within the same paenelboard assembly.

230.71 states: The service disconnecting means shall consist of not more than six switches or sets of circuit breakers, or a combination of not more than six switches and sets of circuit breakers, mounted in a single enclosure, in a group of separate enclosures, or in or on a switchboard. There shall be not more than six sets of disconnects per service grouped in any one location.
 
Once they go rid of the lighting & appliance branch panelboard, that changed things. 2005 no good, 2008 good to go.

Buck what was the resolution.
 
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