microwave question

[jetlag]

Can the microwave unit that fit above the range and also contain the hood vent and light be wired to the 2 kitchen small appliance circuits ? The code says no lights can be wired in. Also if Im not mistaken these units use a regular 120 v plug and cord, if so what is the proper heigth above the counter top to install the receptacle.

 

[cmreschke]

i believe it must be a seperate circuit due to the cord goes through the cabinet and the receptacle is mounted inside the cabinet above the range. cord typically comes out of the top of the appliance the cabinet will be support for the microwave along with the mounting bracket that mounts to the wall. small appliance branch circuit serves countertop receptacles.

 

[curt swartz]

No, you can not connect a fixed appliance to the SA circuits. For a range hood please review 422.16(B)(4). The receptacle needs to be located above the micro/hood not below it. The cords typically come out on the right rear corner.

 

[Fast1911]

what is the proper heigth above the counter top to install the receptacle.

You should really get a cabinet drawing from the cabinet installer to figure the exact location. However, a general measurement would be 36" countertop height, 18" backsplash, 18" height of mircowave, in this instance a safe bet would be 76-80" for the receptacle

 

[Dennis Alwon]

No, you can not connect a fixed appliance to the SA circuits. For a range hood please review 422.16(B)(4). The receptacle needs to be located above the micro/hood not below it. The cords typically come out on the right rear corner.

I mostly agree with curt on this however it can be argued whether 422.16 applies-- Why? simply because the question becomes is this a range hood or a microwave?

422.16 relates to hoods and I happen to know the EI who got that past. The purpose was specifically for the case where a range hood got converted to a microwave. I think this section falls short of accomplishing what it should.

So, back to the OP's question. Most instructions that come with a range hood/ microwave require a separate circuit per the installation instruction. The microwave is not part of the SABC required on the counters so the microwave cannot be connected to the SABC.

I totally agree that the cords all come on the top right side of the hood and the recep. must be install in the cabinet above the hood.

 

[jrohe]

No, an above-range microwave unit can not be on one of the SABCs.

Section 210.52(B)(2) limits SABCs to serving the loads specified in 210.52(B)(1). Section 210.52(B)(1) lists the loads as wall and floor receptacle outlets covered by 210.52(A), countertop outlets covered by 210.52(C), and receptacle outlets for refrigeration equipment. All of these loads must be located in the kitchen, pantry, breakfast room, dining room, or similar area of a dwelling unit.

The microwave receptacle is not a wall or floor receptacle outlet covered in 210.52(A) and it is not a receptacle outlet for refrigeration equipment. Per 210.52(C)(5), in order to be considered a countertop outlet, it must be installed above, but not more than 20 inches above, the countertop. Because the receptacle for an above-range microwave unit typically is installed in the cabinet above the microwave, it would not meet the 20" requirement that would cause it to be considered a countertop receptacle. Therefore, because the receptacle does not meet any of the of the outlet types specified in 210.52(A), section 210.52(B) would not be permit the receptacle to be on an SABC.

I concede that the exception to 210.52(C)(5) permits some outlets to be mounted below the countertop and still be considered a countertop receptacle. However, this exception does not apply to the jetlag's original post.

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

Most will have a short cabinet 30 inches wide above the range. Put your receptacle in the right side of this cabinet and try to stay aout 6 inches from the right and half way between the top and bottom.
What i usually did was just stub out my 12-2 in that location and on trim use 4 sq and raised cover receptacle. And as been said it is a fixed appliance so not on SA and many will require dedicated circuit.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

What i usually did was just stub out my 12-2 in that location and on trim use 4 sq and raised cover receptacle.

Dang, I would have to fire you for that. :grin: Put a box in the wall or cut in an old work box later-- much neater.

 

[Jim W in Tampa]

Dang, I would have to fire you for that. :grin: Put a box in the wall or cut in an old work box later-- much neater.

Neater maybe, Seen far too many cab installers cut a nasty looking opening that plate cover won't cover or not cut out correctly. My way i have less problems on trim. Almost nobody even uses or opens that cabinet anyways.

 

[curt swartz]

I like it when the box gets rough in the center of the cabinet. It makes it a real joy trying to trim out the receptacle behind a duct that is 1" off the wall.

 

[curt swartz]

I mostly agree with curt on this however it can be argued whether 422.16 applies-- Why? simply because the question becomes is this a range hood or a microwave?

422.16 relates to hoods and I happen to know the EI who got that past. The purpose was specifically for the case where a range hood got converted to a microwave. I think this section falls short of accomplishing what it should.

So, back to the OP's question. Most instructions that come with a range hood/ microwave require a separate circuit per the installation instruction. The microwave is not part of the SABC required on the counters so the microwave cannot be connected to the SABC.

I totally agree that the cords all come on the top right side of the hood and the recep. must be install in the cabinet above the hood.

Dennis, are you saying that a micro/hood is not a hood?

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Neater maybe, Seen far too many cab installers cut a nasty looking opening that plate cover won't cover or not cut out correctly. My way i have less problems on trim. Almost nobody even uses or opens that cabinet anyways.

I guess my cabinet guys are smarter and better trained. :grin: I work with just a few and they are top of the line workers. If they mess it up then a new back would go on the cabinet.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Dennis, are you saying that a micro/hood is not a hood?

This was argued before and technically it is listed as a microwave. I think Bob got into this and started all the trouble. :grin: I don't really agree but it was another look at it. The code does say hood and not combo micro/hoods.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Do a search? They are listed in google as over the range microwave ovens.

 

[iwire]

I think Bob got into this and started all the trouble. :grin:

I find that very out of character for me. :grin:

 

[jetlag]

thanks jim

thanks jim

Most will have a short cabinet 30 inches wide above the range. Put your receptacle in the right side of this cabinet and try to stay aout 6 inches from the right and half way between the top and bottom.
What i usually did was just stub out my 12-2 in that location and on trim use 4 sq and raised cover receptacle. And as been said it is a fixed appliance so not on SA and many will require dedicated circuit.

Thats sounds good Im trying to decide how many circuits to pull to kinchen, 2 for small app, 1 for fixed micro, i want frig on a seperate 15 amp, can the disposal and or dish wash be on the line together or on the micro line

 

[Dennis Alwon]

can the disposal and or dish wash be on the line together or on the micro line

Now you've opened a can of worms. It should be allowed, it could be allowed but it also may not be allowed depending on the amps of the units. Put the dw on its own cir and add the disp. to a small lighting cir.

 

[jetlag]

thanks dennis

thanks dennis

Now you've opened a can of worms. It should be allowed, it could be allowed but it also may not be allowed depending on the amps of the units. Put the dw on its own cir and add the disp. to a small lighting cir.

the disposal is 8 amp and the dish wash is 10 amp , do u think will trip on same 20 amp line . my nearest light circuit is loaded

 

[Dennis Alwon]

the disposal is 8 amp and the dish wash is 10 amp , do u think will trip on same 20 amp line . my nearest light circuit is loaded

Technically I think you are in violation but no, I don't think you would ever trip the circuit esp. since the disp. is usually on for seconds.

10 amps X 1.25= 12.5 amps. 8 amps on disposal gives you 20.5 amps. I would not lose sleep on this but your AHJ could challenge it.

 

[Split Bolt]

I stub-out the 12/2 and later cut-in a pop-in. Gives the customer that much more cabinet space! Words of caution based on past experience: If the m/w is not on site during rough-in, get the model # and check the specs on the manufacturer's website. There are a LOT of them now that are 240V, 30A!