NEC UL508A Question

[petersonra]

He always hire an electrician to install the machines and always with city permits .

I ignore all this regulations never new that all the plaques (CE,AJA,etc) you see on the machines means nothing in USA , is good to know that you can't trust a manufacturer ( to be honest i never trust the government )
looks like to buy something or make any decision you have to hire a full stuff of professionals to cover your back lawyers , engineers on different fields , etc . I learn that work for a company has benefits , less headache just do my job and go home relax and leave all the problems at work, this make me think on my ambitions , i was planing to be a licensed electrician and eventually work for myself , but i think i will get my license and look for a good company to work for .

For the most part, except for some relatively minor issues, it is not all that hard to get a foreign built machine to meet US requirements. Just add the following words to your purchase order "Machine to have UL508a listed control panel".

Incidentally, even if the panel is UL508a listed, it still might not be suitable if the SCCR of the panel is lower than the available short circuit current where you plan to install it. The buyer will need to do his homework to determine what the SCCR needs to be. Again, this is not the responsibility of the manufacturer. Many manufacturers default to 10k SCCR on their control panels because it is the cheapest answer. It is not all that hard to exceed 10k of available short circuit current though.

 

[DANINAD]

the newest machine (2013) has 25KA and looks like will be one with less problems , now the older ones does not have sccr on the info , and i did not check but components may not have an sccr rating ider so will be nice to know the criteria used in this case . this machines are older than 2001

also i am wonder on the cable color code used if will be different than the new UL508A , what they use in 1998 NEC for color code ?

 

[petersonra]

the newest machine (2013) has 25KA and looks like will be one with less problems , now the older ones does not have sccr on the info , and i did not check but components may not have an sccr rating ider so will be nice to know the criteria used in this case . this machines are older than 2001

also i am wonder on the cable color code used if will be different than the new UL508A , what they use in 1998 NEC for color code ?

one of the benefits of getting the panel UL508a listed is that it will come with a SCCR. It is one of the requirements for UL508a listing. There is no way to tell without a close look but the first thing to getting a SCCR is to get it built in accordance with UL508a. Then it can be evaluated according to the SCCR evaluation procedure UL508a uses. If the thing has components not allowed by UL508a, it is likely they will have to be replaced, although UL508a allows for some limited ability to use unevaluated components.

If by cable you mean multiconductor cable, the color coding is flexible to some extent. If by cable you mean individual conductors, UL508a has a color code that is required to be followed.

In general, the conductor color code used inside a listed piece of equipment has little to do with the few color choices the NEC specifies for conductors, although for the most part they are quite similar, but UL508a is more restrictive.

 

[DANINAD]

one of the benefits of getting the panel UL508a listed is that it will come with a SCCR. It is one of the requirements for UL508a listing. There is no way to tell without a close look but the first thing to getting a SCCR is to get it built in accordance with UL508a. Then it can be evaluated according to the SCCR evaluation procedure UL508a uses. If the thing has components not allowed by UL508a, it is likely they will have to be replaced, although UL508a allows for some limited ability to use unevaluated components.

If by cable you mean multiconductor cable, the color coding is flexible to some extent. If by cable you mean individual conductors, UL508a has a color code that is required to be followed.

In general, the conductor color code used inside a listed piece of equipment has little to do with the few color choices the NEC specifies for conductors, although for the most part they are quite similar, but UL508a is more restrictive.

Yes bob i was meant on the cable colors for the control panel . because this 1998 machine has a color code applied to the control panel but if UL508A was not available at that time they may use other codes i assume was NEC ( not idea what was available at that time ).

yes individual conductors

Thanks
Daniel

 

[petersonra]

Yes bob i was meant on the cable colors for the control panel . because this 1998 machine has a color code applied to the control panel but if UL508A was not available at that time they may use other codes i assume was NEC ( not idea what was available at that time ).

yes individual conductors

Thanks
Daniel

UL508a has been around since at least the mid to late 80s.

before that the most common control panel spec in the US was JIC. The color code on it is the same as UL508a. It had been around since before the depression in one form or another. NFPA79 (the standard for industrial machines) also uses the same color coding for conductors.

 

[DANINAD]

UL508a has been around since at least the mid to late 80s.

before that the most common control panel spec in the US was JIC. The color code on it is the same as UL508a. It had been around since before the depression in one form or another. NFPA79 (the standard for industrial machines) also uses the same color coding for conductors.

Awesome , that's mean that the cable color has more chances to be correct and even if some component has to be changed , we will not have to replace the all cable harness

I was read on the internet that the UL508 first edition was on april 2001 and revised on 2005 , so if it was since mid 80s if they respect the codes should be very decent .

looking for some connectors to replace on one machine before the inspection , don't want to be the cause of a rejection .(is just a plastic adapter between the corrugated plastic and the connector )

 

[petersonra]

Awesome , that's mean that the cable color has more chances to be correct and even if some component has to be changed , we will not have to replace the all cable harness

I was read on the internet that the UL508 first edition was on april 2001 and revised on 2005 , so if it was since mid 80s if they respect the codes should be very decent .

looking for some connectors to replace on one machine before the inspection , don't want to be the cause of a rejection .(is just a plastic adapter between the corrugated plastic and the connector )

UL508 is not the same thing as UL508a.

UL508 is for industrial control equipment. PLCs are listed to this standard, for example.

http://database.ul.com/cgi-bin/XYV/...n=versionless&parent_id=1073990370&sequence=1

UL508a is for industrial control panels.

 

[Jraef]

My brother and I owned a UL508A listed panel shop in 1978... but I know it was around before that. California was leading the way in requiring UL listing of control panels back when most other states did not.

What changed in 2005 was that the NEC added Article 409, which stipulated the NEC requirement of having an SCCR on any "industrial control panel" as defined therein, and in an FPN (Fine Print Note) pointed to UL508A Supplement SB as ONE OF the ways of attaining said SCCR. Coincidentally, 2005 is when UL added Supplement SB...