"Not in my town" Still Applies

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iwire

iwire

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A friend of mine is fitting out a retail space at a large mall, he is working for a GC that has worked there for years. The GC tells my buddy the electrical inspector expects GFCI protection on all receptacles. Now my buddy knows this is not required so he presses the GC on it.

The GC explains how the inspector expects GFCI protection because of the bare concrete floor. :rolleyes:

It's indoors, it is not a wet location, there are no sinks or kitchens. The floor finish is clear epoxy on cement.

So in the interest of moving ahead my buddy ordered seven Square D GFCI breakers. :mad: There is no choice, the company could file a complaint with the State but that would take more time then we have.
 
I run into this all the time. Lots of little "the inspector wants this" type of stuff that may seem minor but when you add it all up it's lots of wasted time and money. :mad:
 
I guess that bare concrete floor magically makes that retail space a garage or unfinished basement? :-?

Too bad he doesn't have the time to get that straightened out. A pure abuse of power or outright ignorance. Hard to say which one.
 
I am confused about the whole "the inspector wants this" discussion. I am an inspector and that does not make me the God (or Goddess in my case) of electricity. If a contractor questions my decision and I can't come up with a legitimate code reference to back me up, I can't and won't enforce it. I don't think contractors should have to be afraid of the inspector. Contractors have every right and authority to question if something is being enforced that is not in the code or in a local ordinance. Inspectors are obligated to know the code and not be enforcing personal opinion. I argued plenty with inspectors when I was contracting. I guess that's just my opinion.
 
raider1 said:
These kind of inspectors make me mad.:mad: They are the ones who give inspectors a bad name.

Chris
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I agree, and we have them here too. Fortunately for us there's a hotline to call the AHJ for backup. She will even ask for the inspector's phone number to straighten him out if he's way off base.
 
iwire said:
So in the interest of moving ahead my buddy ordered seven Square D GFCI breakers. :mad: There is no choice, the company could file a complaint with the State but that would take more time then we have.
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In the interest of getting the job completed it's alright to pay for the breakers but they could still file a complaint with the state.

No reason not to jerk a little slack out of this guy's chain. :grin:
 
jshaw said:
I don't think contractors should have to be afraid of the inspector. Contractors have every right and authority to question if something is being enforced that is not in the code or in a local ordinance.
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I guess when you've done that a time or two, and felt the consequences, the option sometimes becomes undesirable. It not fear at all that drives a contractor to just 'go along'. It the interesting in maintaining the schedule and not creating a sore point for the GC (particularly one you've never worked for before, or who you work for very little, who you need to impress). Not every inspector takes questioning so kindly.
 
growler said:
In the interest of getting the job completed it's alright to pay for the breakers but they could still file a complaint with the state.
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Thats the only way it could be done. I wish we had a hotline like NJ.
 
I guess we have a unique situation here. If the contractor has a problem with a correction notice they can contact me and usually have the issue resolved one way the other the same day so there is no real delay. We are a small jurisdiction. I guess in larger jurisdictions it may not be as easy to resolve an issue.

I get really frustrated when I hear about inspectors who think they have some kind of power over contractors. We are all on the same team. We are working together to follow the same code and neither one of us is perfect.
 
the contractor should stand his ground, and force the inspector to come up with a code section, I wonder what the GC would do if the the inspector wanted him to change a job from a code compliant job to a violation because that is what the inspector wanted

never heard of any hotline in new jersey
 
I have run into several of these inspectors in the MA area. I have no problem asking for a code article if there is an aledged violation. At every code update I have ever attended this topic always comes up and all the providers (Leo Martin, Joe Ross, Bill Laidler) all swear there is to be one uniform code in the state. I think we know this is not always the case.

Joe
 
man here we are in a push and shove situation..You can take the time and force the inspector to see it your way..then the inspector get a bur under his saddle and then micro inspects all of your jobs for awhile..in the end to comply with the inspectors wishes only cost few bucks anyway..better to have positive relationship with inspector than a negative..Inspectors are not God but they are employed by the state as their electrical cops..most of the time they are not hard asses, they are just trying to do the best job at safety enforcement as possible in each individual situation..
 
cschmid

if I am wrong i want to know, not have a contractor do something that is not required just to make me happy, i inspect the same if your nice or nasty or if I am wrong or right, selective enforcement is not a good practice and can cost an inspector his or her job
 
The problem with just giving in and doing what the inspector wants, is that this will just feed into the inspectors thinking that "I am the inspector and what I say goes". Inspectors with this attitude need to be stood up to and made to understand their job is not to enforce their own wishes, but only the adopted codes. I do understand the position that a contractor or electrician is put in, I have been there.

Chris
 
I had a conversation with a local inspector just yesterday and he said that an inspection should be a learning process. He also admitted that the process works both ways.

Joe
 
Then there's......

Then there's......

I heard a good one today that had me laughing, and maybe I am wrong, am I? I had a guy call me and tell me his insurance adjuster told him his SEU service drop is so longer UV protected because it was painted:roll: It needed to be done over:cool:

Want me to run that by you again? I haven't even tried to look in my book. I have never heard this one. Maybe the joke is on me, but I know one of you will respond quicker than I can go grab my '05.

"You won't paint your drop in my town." I could really make some extra money if I teamed up with that guy!
 
I thought GFIs were specifically not recommended for some loads.
 
langjahr@comcast.net said:
I thought GFIs were specifically not recommended for some loads.
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As far as I know the only load type that the NEC recognizes as a problem with GFCI is electric heat trace cable.

All appliances, motors etc are supposed to operate on GFCIs. I think Marc has mentioned problems with some specific garage door openers.
 
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