Old existing load side panel without ground bar?

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zemingduan

Member
Location
Philadelphia,PA
Occupation
Electrical Designer
Hi guys please see the the picture below. The existing panel is not a service equipment but located at the load side of the service disconnect means. It is an pretty old panel in an old school. It looks like this panel doesn't have a ground bar or equipment grounding conductors coming from upstream main distribution panel. And the green grounding wire is connected to the neutral bar, which is definitely a code violation. The building does have grounding rods and the service is grounded in basement. My questions:

1. Is it possible that a pretty old load side electrical panel when installed didn't need a ground bar if this panel only supplies some lights and old non-grounding type receptacles? But shouldn't you need EGC to the panel and ground the metal enclosure? I didn't find any EGC coming from upstream equipment.

2. I now need to add some new lights and receptacles to some existing branch circuits. I think code requires me to bring new EGC from upstream main distribution panel and replace this panel with separate ground bar or add a separate ground bar. Correct?

3. For the existing branch circuits supplying non-grounding type receptacles that has no new work. I think code doesn't require me to replace these receptacles to grounding type and bring EGC to them. I just need to mark these receptacles as "No equipment ground". Correct?

4. For the existing branch circuit that I need to extend and install new receptacles, do I need to bring EGC to the existing non-grounding type receptacles supplied by that bran circuit and to the new installed receptacles?

I am just asking and want to know what code says about this. I do suggest owner to bring EGC to the existing panel and receptacles and replace all the old receptacles to avoid fire and shock. But they may don't want to do that LOL. By the way I am an electrical designer not an electrician and not very familiar with the installation and wiring method. Thanks!

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petersonra

Senior Member
Location
Northern illinois
Occupation
engineer
Is it possible the incoming power is fed via a metallic conduit? If so the conduit could serve as the EGC and all you would have to do is install a groundbar to the sheet metal of the enclosure and move the green wires there
 

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Is it possible the incoming power is fed via a metallic conduit? If so the conduit could serve as the EGC and all you would have to do is install a groundbar to the sheet metal of the enclosure and move the green wires there
I agree. Given the age of the panel the raceway is almost certain to be metal and was installed to serve as the panel EGC. Just install a ground bar as Bob suggested.
 
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