Jim W in Tampa
Senior Member
- Location
- Tampa Florida
Yes but he owes us hundreds of pictures
Panel in closet
- Thread starter RESI
- Start date
- Status
Pierre C Belarge
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
All in good time Jim, in good time...
do you remember what movie the line is from -minus Jim's name???
Pierre C Belarge
Senior Member
- Location
- Westchester County, New York
LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
The Wizard of Oz?All in good time Jim, in good time...
do you remember what movie the line is from -minus Jim's name???
radiopet
Senior Member
- Location
- Spotsylvania, VA
Why are you wondering what the local municipal will do. Regardless of what the people here tell you, you will still need to deal with your local inspector and he/she is the one you should be calling to ask. Regardless of the labeling or classification of the room in question, if their was nothing that prohibited it at the orginal time of installation and if you are placing it back in the same location...even if upgrading to a higher ampacity..under the VUSBC it would be considered a like for like installation and compliant.
Contact your local AHJ and Deputies for the AHJ ( Electrical Inspectors ) and tell them what you are doing and get their view on it as they are the ones who will have to pass it and will also appreciate you keeping them in the loop...I know I would be.
Contact your local AHJ and Deputies for the AHJ ( Electrical Inspectors ) and tell them what you are doing and get their view on it as they are the ones who will have to pass it and will also appreciate you keeping them in the loop...I know I would be.
mcclary's electrical
Senior Member
- Location
- VA
Paul, do you still offer your services to the city of Richmond?
electricmanscott
Senior Member
- Location
- Boston, MA
If I were the inspector My reply would be "do it to code". That is also how I would inspect it. Also I don't work for the inspector, the inspector works for me. I don't think I have ever asked how to do something nor have I ever even thought that they should be kept "in the loop".
Pierre's answer was pretty clear and to the point. Form what I am reading by the OP there is no reason this panel can't stay where it is.
growler
Senior Member
- Location
- Atlanta,GA
The inspector in Newport News, VA doesn't work for you. You are right in that he may be able to leave it where it is with no problems but the only way he will know is a 5 minute phone call to the local authorities.
The only difference between your opinion and the local inspector's opinion is that his actually counts.
Jim W in Tampa
Senior Member
- Location
- Tampa Florida
"Originally Posted by electricmanscott
the inspector works for me. "
That is partly true. Yes you pay him but he works for you and everyone in your county and state to inforce building codes. You can not fire him and have no options about hiring him.
Unless there is something we have not been told it looks like a legal install. He says he has 31 inches width by 36 inches depth (in front of live parts in panel) and 91 inches high. So looks like he passes 110.26 as long as no hazards in area.So yes legal. Now we deal with should he call the inspector first. No not required but if it was a sure thing he would not asked for input. Would it not be smart to take 5 minutes and call the inspector ? Could be something we all missed like a local code. And like it or not all inspectors are not like the ones on this forum. Some make up there own rules and fighting them could be more trouble than it is worth.
Next will you be telling us the president of USA works for you ???????
the inspector works for me. "
That is partly true. Yes you pay him but he works for you and everyone in your county and state to inforce building codes. You can not fire him and have no options about hiring him.
Unless there is something we have not been told it looks like a legal install. He says he has 31 inches width by 36 inches depth (in front of live parts in panel) and 91 inches high. So looks like he passes 110.26 as long as no hazards in area.So yes legal. Now we deal with should he call the inspector first. No not required but if it was a sure thing he would not asked for input. Would it not be smart to take 5 minutes and call the inspector ? Could be something we all missed like a local code. And like it or not all inspectors are not like the ones on this forum. Some make up there own rules and fighting them could be more trouble than it is worth.
Next will you be telling us the president of USA works for you ???????
electricmanscott
Senior Member
- Location
- Boston, MA
The inspector in Newport News, VA doesn't work for you. You are right in that he may be able to leave it where it is with no problems but the only way he will know is a 5 minute phone call to the local authorities.
The only difference between your opinion and the local inspector's opinion is that his actually counts.
The day I have to start calling ahead to have somebody tell me how to do my job is the day I send my license through the shredder.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
Most AHJ inspectors are public employees and can be fired, usually have to follow a process to do so, if he shows signs of gross negligence it sure helps speed up the process.
The president is publically elected and can be publically removed from office. It may not happen in a meeting lasting just a few minutes but it can happen.
Jim W in Tampa
Senior Member
- Location
- Tampa Florida
Yes they can be fired but not by just one electrician not says YOUR FIRED.
Now if your working for an EC the boss can say YOUR FIRED or if your the boss you can fire the employee.
Love to see the electrician tell the inspector YOUR FIRED ,LOL
bet he would laugh all the way back to his truck after leaving you a red tag
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
If an inspector is incompetent every electrician he inspects for needs to report problems to the inspectors supervisor otherwise if they just do what he wants, they are doing themselves an injustice. If the inspectors supervisor gets enough complaints because he is doing things wrong he may eventually get fired. Same type of thing with the president there are always going to be a small number of people that do not like something about a public official but when enough people have the same problem then something may be able to be done about it.
growler
Senior Member
- Location
- Atlanta,GA
Scott I have done electrical work in several different states and I have found that it's always a good idea to know who you are dealing with.
You don't ask how to do your job, you try to find out how they are doing theirs.
electricmanscott
Senior Member
- Location
- Boston, MA
I can understand that. I just don't have the time or desire to work to the wills of the inspectors. I go out of my way to make sure I am in compliance with the code that is in effect here in MA. It does make it easier that we have one code that is adopted statewide. I don't claim to be a code expert by any means but should a problem arise with an inspector I make damn sure I know what I am talking about before I do battle.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
At our meeting in Raleigh this year one of the cmp members said that a panel, with breakers, may be installed in a clothes closet depending on where it was. He gave an example of a space by the door that would be behind the door and comply with 110.26
Volta
Senior Member
- Location
- Columbus, Ohio
Sure you can find working clearance, but it seems like a location with easily ignitable items to me 240.24(D). Was this person part of CMP 10?
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
No, but think about it. How close would those ignitables, esp. in a clothes closet, have to be to start a fire. If there is nothing stored above it or around it I cannot see an issue.
I don't know what panel he was on and I can't even remember who it was. Maybe Roger will remember.
Of course, this was just his opinion-- for what it is worth. I have hear others say the same. The code does not say you cannot install OCPD in a clothes closet. BTW, I never have installed one there nor do I intend to since this issue is too unclear.
Volta
Senior Member
- Location
- Columbus, Ohio
For a normal overload, even a termination to a breaker becoming over heated, no big deal, porbably. But for a more catastrophic fault that pushes the device to its limit, the ease of a fire starting may cost someone measurable time in vacating the premises
The code comes pretty darn close to saying it:
So close that I can't even tell that they are not saying it240.24(D) said:
.
- Location
- Chapel Hill, NC
- Occupation
- Retired Electrical Contractor
Volta the argument is that the OCPD should not be located in the vicinity of ignitable materials such as you would find in a clothes closet. Now in the vicinity means what? In the same room, under it, next to it, 2 foot away.....
If it is in an area of the closet where there are no ignitables then many believe it is okay. I tend to agree but I know it will fail in most areas.
Think of a closet with a 30" door that opens up to a 30" wide wall perpendicular to it. The panel is behind the door. How can ignitables be a problem when they are possible many feet away.
My point is this is up to interpretation and IMO, many inspectors and ec's believe that the code states you cannot have a OCPD in a closet. I am not sure it states that.
If it is in an area of the closet where there are no ignitables then many believe it is okay. I tend to agree but I know it will fail in most areas.
Think of a closet with a 30" door that opens up to a 30" wide wall perpendicular to it. The panel is behind the door. How can ignitables be a problem when they are possible many feet away.
My point is this is up to interpretation and IMO, many inspectors and ec's believe that the code states you cannot have a OCPD in a closet. I am not sure it states that.
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