Panel installation

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Seriously

romeo said:
110.26(B)(3) Clear Working Space The working space requiered by this section must be clear at all times. I took this from Mike Holts book Understanding The NEC. it goes on to prohibit using this space for storage.
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And what homeowner ever reads 110.26???? I've been in basements that you needed hiking equipment and a box lunch, just to get to the panel,,,lol, you can tell them, but that doesn't mean they'll do it,, kind of like the horse and water thing ;)

J.S.Harvey
 
Panel Installation

Panel Installation

jsharvey said:
And what homeowner ever reads 110.26???? I've been in basements that you needed hiking equipment and a box lunch, just to get to the panel,,,lol, you can tell them, but that doesn't mean they'll do it,, kind of like the horse and water thing ;)

J.S.Harvey[/QUOT

I agree if you think home owners are bad try visiting some schools sometime,but that is not the issue. The issue is should the electrician install a panel behind a door. IMO no does 110.26(B)(3) prohibit it? IMO yes
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Panel Installation

Panel Installation

jsharvey said:
And what homeowner ever reads 110.26???? I've been in basements that you needed hiking equipment and a box lunch, just to get to the panel,,,lol, you can tell them, but that doesn't mean they'll do it,, kind of like the horse and water thing ;)

J.S.Harvey[/QUOT

I agree if you think home owners are bad try visiting some schools sometime,but that is not the issue. The issue is should the electrician install a panel behind a door. IMO no does 110.26(B)(3) prohibit it? IMO yes
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I have managed to avoid instaling a panel behind a door for 16 years execpt this one instance. I agree, its a bad place for equipment. In this instance, the inspector had shown a real willingness to work with us on several issues.(1908 house, historical society involved, very picky HO, etc. ) Icertainly wasn't argueing over something so small. I still belive it is a good idea to have the OPTION-yes option- to lock the door IF I SO CHOOSE. The door don't lock on its own. I was just trying to share my experience with this situation.
 
I still belive it is a good idea to have the OPTION-yes option- to lock the door IF I SO CHOOSE.
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So are you going to pay for the lockable door? It is not a code violation to install a panel behind a door. I find it hard to require someone to install a "lockable door" to fix something that is not a code violation.

I agree with mdshunk,

I rather prefer to mount panels behind a door. That assures that tons of crap won't get stacked there.
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The issue is should the electrician install a panel behind a door. IMO no does 110.26(B)(3) prohibit it? IMO yes
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110.26(B) requires that the clear working space not be used for storage, if you have a door there then this helps assure that the space can't be used for storage.

Chris
 
raider1 said:
Then put a door stopper under the door when you are working on the panel.

Unless there is a local requirement, the AHJ can't require the door to be lockable, as this is not an NEC requirement.

Chris
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Oh yes he can.
 
Almost every apartment that I have worked on in Southern California has a panel behind a bedroom door, mostly because people don't want to see it there in the middle of the hall or something.

The AHJ can ask for anything he wants and maybe he can even bluff his way through. A smart contractor will not let that happen and will take it as far as he needs to to insure that only the code is being enforced and not the inspectors personal likes and dislikes.
 
An inspector can make a wrong call like the "water source" issue or the door swing and his superiors will many times back him up even though there is no written code that is getting violated. The "water source" issue has happened to me also. It is like the old western movies where they pin a deputy badge on the guy and suddenly whatever he says is law. In my area we have some really good apples for inspectors, and some who would not recognise a code book if you served them lunch on it. The ones who cannot be bothered with learning the code at all still get complete backing from the top , cause after all they are the ones wearing the badge, so they must know what they are doing.
 
The issue of a panel behind a door is a double edged sword !!!!!! On one hand it is not forbiden as far as the NEC is concerned,there is nothing that prevents it on the other side of the sword is a safety issue.I would hate to be the one working on a panel and the door flys open sending me into a hot panel.A lock has keys so in order to use a locking door as a reason to allow it is a moot subject,who might have the key and open it not knowing you are there.

I`ve had this exact issue with inspectors in the past and when I said just show me where it is not allowed and I`ll move it they conceded.Personal opinions aren`t in the scope of inspections.Code violations are and there is no code violation.
 
Panel Installation

Panel Installation

macmikeman said:
An inspector can make a wrong call like the "water source" issue or the door swing and his superiors will many times back him up even though there is no written code that is getting violated. The "water source" issue has happened to me also. It is like the old western movies where they pin a deputy badge on the guy and suddenly whatever he says is law. In my area we have some really good apples for inspectors, and some who would not recognise a code book if you served them lunch on it. The ones who cannot be bothered with learning the code at all still get complete backing from the top , cause after all they are the ones wearing the badge, so they must know what they are doing.
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WOW seems that you have been abused by inspectors. There are good inspectors that are interested in public saftey. You are correct inspectors can make a wrong call I know i have. I wish there were more electrician more interested in public saftey than becomming rich.

Remember there is an appeal process and inspectors are required to site code sections. If you are really up to date on the code and he is not you will shine .
 
Call the chief every time the inspector fails to cite code number.After a while he will get tired of the calls and have a chat with the inspector.From then on he knows you will fight back and he best be right.I dont like playing it this way but have in past where needed.Seems i was not the only contractor complaining and he was soon moved to a desk job.Let them get the idea you will do whatever they say and you will never win.
 
Jim we have dealt with many of the same inspectors over the past and I agree.Know what you are fighting for and you come out ahead.If right argue to the top and if wrong eat that bowl of crow.Heaven knows i`ve done both.....But my inspectors know that when they see me get out of my truck that the inspection will be either passed or corrected if need be.Inspectors are not perfect, neither are electricians.

The inspectors here all know and respect me that`s the key.They know that if they cite something that they better be right.All I want is to get through each day and go home just as they do.But if they come out of pocket with some off the wall request I will go straight to the chief and get him out to reinspect.He knows that if I call him to come out I have my guns loaded and cocked.
 
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