Panelboard in shallow closet

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jkp3030

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Does the following meet the requirements for working space ?

(2) panelboards in a shallow closet (12" deep and width slightly greater than the combined panelboard width) built and dedicated for the panels. The closet has double doors that when opened provide the required width (the door opening exceeds the combined width of the panels). The working space depth is also more than met when the doors are open. When the doors are shut, there is only 6" clearance, but of course no one could be in the closet.

I had done this on several jobs but now I have an inspector rejecting the installation.

The conversation with the inspector went like this:

"You need 3 feet".

"But you have 3 feet with the door open"

"But not with the door closed"

"But nobody can fit in there with the door closed"

"You need 3 feet"

"But nobody can fit in there with the door closed"

"You need 3 feet"

(You get the idea)
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

This is a very common installation in a number of hospitals I work in.

The panels are in locked closets in corridors that when open allows the required front and side clearances.

This is an excellent space saver as well as allowing the panels to be located closer to the loads served. It also keeps the areas in front of these panels clear of obstructions, i.e. storage materials found in normal electrical closets.

The inspector must have layed out the day common sense, (or for that matter any sense) was being handed out. ;)

Roger

[ February 16, 2006, 08:57 AM: Message edited by: roger ]
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

As an electrician and Inspector. We do this a lot and We pass it. The intent of 110.26 "Working clearance" and like You said "that common sense thing".
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

<sigh> :roll:

This type of installation is as common as dirt. It's an excellent description of my own home: two panels, side by side in a shallow space with a door directly in front of the panels. I wouldn't even call it a closet. The width of the door is greater than the combined width of the panels (and > 30"), the door opens more than 90 degrees and there's more than 6 feet of completely unobstructed space in front of the panels when the door is open. Around here that's what often happens to a panel in a finished basement.

The OP is in a tough spot since the inspector has abandoned any pretext at common sense. It's always a bad idea to go over the head of someone you have to deal with regularly and who has to approve your work and your livelihood, but I don't see any other out.
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

jpk: You didn't mention this, but Mike brings up an important additional requirement:
Originally posted by Mike03a3:. . . the (panel) door opens more than 90 degrees . . . .
Click to expand...
You might point out to the inspector that there are words in the NEC that support your point of view (which, by the way, I also agree with). 110.26(A) says that working clearance is required for equipment that may require some type of work while energized. When the closet doors in front of the panels you described are closed, the panels cannot, ever, require work.
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

Remove doors for reinspection,after sign off replace doors, thank inspector for setting you straight on this issue.
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

Originally posted by benaround:
Remove doors for reinspection,after sign off replace doors, thank inspector for setting you straight on this issue.
Click to expand...
That would be no different than capping off a light in the closet without clearance from the storage space, then rehanging it after the sign off. It would still be in violation, but not in jpks instance.

jpks installation is not uncommon in finished basements around here. It is all about the excuse of the H.O. not wanting to see unsightly elec equipment. As Charlie stated, with the doors closed, it cannot be serviced.

If the point beyond the doors are unfinished, could this even be called a "closet"? Better yet, would it be considered an unfinished area and require a GFCI protected outlet?
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

I vote for slapping the stupid inspector.

Roger
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

By his reasoning then a panel behind a door that swings into the panel would be a violation.Try that one on him and see what he says.
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

Originally posted by allenwayne: By his reasoning then a panel behind a door that swings into the panel would be a violation.Try that one on him and see what he says.
Click to expand...
He will probably say that it is a violation. :(
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

Originally posted by roger:
I vote for slapping the stupid inspector.

Roger
Click to expand...
I second the motion

Edited to add:

All in favor say "aye"

[ February 17, 2006, 05:06 PM: Message edited by: jwelectric ]
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

The doors are standard 6'8".
I have heard that there have been proposals in the past to the NEC to prohibit this installation, and that they were rejected. How would I find or get a copy of that? That would be a good way of arguing my case.
 
Re: Panelboard in shallow closet

JKP, I suggest a new conversation:

"You need three feet."

You open doors.

"There's your three feet."

Inspector closes doors.

"You need three feet."

"Why?"

"For the panels."

"What panels?"

Inspector opens doors.

"These panels."

"There's your three feet."

[ February 19, 2006, 05:51 PM: Message edited by: LarryFine ]
 
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