Panels and tandems and approvals oh my...

[ritelec]

Called to install an generator inlet.. so Here's the panel..
No room for the two poll, and I'm making an educated guess that the siemans lock out fits this panel board cover...

BUT........ all the tandems??? Bryant square D home lines......... ?? Drives me crazy, approved, not approved..??

I'm thinking about doing what I need to do to get a sub panel out of it to fit the 2 pole generator breaker and leave all the rest of it the way it is..man...
This gets so aggravating


little research shows that home lines are approved in not just home line panels but that and the tandems.... geez..

what would you guys do?...... re breaker it. or do whats needed for the sub panel and call it a day ?

Thanks

 

[MAC702]

It all depends on who's paying for it, of course.

Some things are worth telling the owner about, some things are worth serious advisement, some things are worth just doing your job, and some things are worth walking away from. It's all the unknown details that decide which.

I see panels like this every day.

 

[ritelec]

Good Answer ... :thumbsup:

 

[ritelec]

I see panels like this every day.

Too many...

 

[MAC702]

Too many...

The real world.

Residential and commercial. I think restaurants are the worst.

 

[jaggedben]

I notice there's an ITE label on it.

 

[norcal]

I notice there's an ITE label on it.

And production of that ITE Imperial Corp panel ended in the late 1970's.


I do not think that any SQ D breaker is classified to be used in competitive panels.

 

[Little Bill]

And production of that ITE Imperial Corp panel ended in the late 1970's.


I do not think that any SQ D breaker is classified to be used in competitive panels.

Siemens breakers are allowed since they took over the ITE line.
Eaton-C/H have classified breakers for that as well.

 

[norcal]

Siemens breakers are allowed since they took over the ITE line.
Eaton-C/H have classified breakers for that as well.

Yes, I only commented about the SQ D breakers, ITE Imperial, Gould/ITE, ITE Electrical Products, Siemens would all be OEM breakers for that panel. As far as I am concerned, those are the only ones that should be there, but the UL classified are OK too, just don't care for them, & have the same opinion about the UL classified QO replacements that Siemens & Eaton make, but where the manufacturer has disappeared there is no choice but a classified breaker. Zinsco/Sylvania, & FPE, come to mind.

 

[ritelec]

Thank you

 

[ritelec]

Gonna give s closer look this week. But what also gets me is those newer inspection stickers ???

 

[jaggedben]

Gonna give s closer look this week. But what also gets me is those newer inspection stickers ???

There's nothing in the code that requires old equipment to be replaced.

The wrong 1" breakers is a violation I see overlooked a LOT by inspectors, especially if previously existing and not put in as part of the current permit. Of the two dozen or so AHJs we work in regularly, I can think of two where we have been asked to replace previously existing breakers of incorrect make.

 

[kwired]

And production of that ITE Imperial Corp panel ended in the late 1970's.


I do not think that any SQ D breaker is classified to be used in competitive panels.

Square D may make a "classified breaker" for this, but if so it is not the standard "Homeline" breaker. Standard Homeline will fit and will function - just has not been listed for such purpose.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

Won't the new Siemens breaker fit this panel?

 

[ritelec]

just some info..... 1st shot is blurry, but it has a slew of SQ D Panel boards that siemens breakers are classified to be used in (not in series rated system). following 3 are important.

 

[jaggedben]

Yeah, so if you wanna be thorough here, remove the Homeline and Bryant etc. Breakers and replace with Siemens or Murray. Or if you wanna be super punctilious, Siemens and not Murray.

 

[ritelec]

Yeah, so if you wanna be thorough here, remove the Homeline and Bryant etc. Breakers and replace with Siemens or Murray. Or if you wanna be super punctilious, Siemens and not Murray.

and tandems............ (replace the square D tandems with Siemens ??)
I think a 100 amp sub panel next to it would do. There should be no issues installing a 100 amp breaker on those buss bars I would think.
and of course, pending if the home owner goes for it.
He called for a generator hook up not a panel rework.. is what it is.
Thank you

 

[kwired]

just some info..... 1st shot is blurry, but it has a slew of SQ D Panel boards that siemens breakers are classified to be used in (not in series rated system). following 3 are important.

Some the QO panels like in the last image that had aluminum bus bars fail like shown even with genuine QO breakers installed.

and tandems............ (replace the square D tandems with Siemens ??)
I think a 100 amp sub panel next to it would do. There should be no issues installing a 100 amp breaker on those buss bars I would think.
and of course, pending if the home owner goes for it.
He called for a generator hook up not a panel rework.. is what it is.
Thank you

Thing with tandems is do the instructions say that you can put tandems in that panel, and if so in which positions.

Sure the 42 circuit rule is gone today but that panel is still listed for whatever it was listed for when it was new. If it is a CTL rated panel it should have rejection feature for spaces not intended for tandems.

 

[norcal]

Won't the new Siemens breaker fit this panel?

Just fine and in my opinion the best choice. BTW, it is a CTL panel.

 

[jaggedben]

I agree it's a CTL panel unless someone tampered with that Homeline breaker. Is the original panel label not there?