parallel raceway EGC size

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ekbrunn

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I have a contractor installing a 225-amp feeder. He comes off the circuit breaker with a 4/0 conductor and goes into a j-box where he changes over to two sets of parallel 4/0 conductors per phase, one set in each of two 2? metal raceways. The feeder length continues approximately 300 feet where another changeover back to a single set of 4/0 conductors occurs in a j-box and that set terminates in a disconnect.
Where there is a single set of 4/0 conductors the installed equipment-grounding conductor is a #4. He also installed a single #4 in each of the paralleled raceways.
Applying 250.122(B) and 250.122(F), he feels he is compliant; two times the size of the #4 is equal to two #4?s. I believe the EGC in each of the paralleled raceways needs to be increased to #1 to be proportional, as required by 250.122(B). Am I misinterpreting the requirement?
Thanks for the help.
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Are you saying there is a total of (4) of each phase conductors between the J boxes; (2) A and (2) B in each 2" conduit?

If so, then yes the EGC would need to be paralleled per 250.122(F)

Now what if he eliminated the #4 and just used the metalic conduit?

Roger

[ June 25, 2004, 05:35 PM: Message edited by: roger ]
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

If I understand your post, it is only (2) sets of conductors, and each set is in a conduit by itself. I think the #4 in each conduit is right per (F). Each EGC has to be sized for the 225A breaker.


Steve
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Steve, I think you are right, but this
two sets of parallel 4/0 conductors per phase
is confussing me.

Roger
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

I knew this would be confusing, been a long day already. There are actually only two conductors per phase between the j-boxes. These are installed as three ungrounded conductors with a grounded conductor (and the grounding conductor in question) within a 2" raceway, and there are two raceways. The contractor effectively has provided twice the required kcmil area as is required for the circuit, 225 amp.
So the question is still...do the EGC conductors need to be doubled in size (#1 AWG size conductor) AND THAT SIZE BE INSTALLED IN EACH RACEWAY?
I hope this clears up any confusion.
As far as just removing the installed EGC and using the raceway (EMT), that is not an option due to other requirements of the project.
Thanks again.

[ June 25, 2004, 09:24 PM: Message edited by: ekbrunn ]
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Ekbrunn, I agree with Steve, but the wording could be as you interpret it also. :confused:

I wonder how you could order parallel EGC's in a large cable assembly.

Wirebender, this would be for Voltage Drop.

Roger
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

I believe the installation is compliant per 250.122(f).


[ F) Conductors in Parallel. Where conductors are run in parallel in multiple raceways or cables as permitted in 310.4, the equipment grounding conductors, where used, shall be run in parallel in each raceway or cable. One of the methods in 250.122(F)(1) or (2) shall be used to ensure the equipment grounding conductors are protected. (1) Each parallel equipment grounding conductor shall be sized on the basis of the ampere rating of the overcurrent device protecting the circuit conductors in the raceway or cable in accordance with Table 250.122.
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Roger,
In a large cable assembly the standard manufactured size would be able to be used according to 250.122(F)(2) only under the three qualifying conditions.

Wirebender,
My thinking is that 250.122(B) first requires the EGC be adjusted to be proportional to the ungrounded conductor size, THEN 250.122(F) states that each parallel raceway should contain that size equipment grounding conductor. If the conductors were all installed in a single raceway, and without requiring any derating, a single #1 AWG would suffice. Since there are two raceways now, EACH raceway MUST contain the #1 AWG conductor per 250.122(F). The 2002 NEC Handbook explains it better than I could.

Nick,
With this line of reasoning, do you still believe the #3 AWG in each raceway still compliant?

Concerning the earlier question from Roger about eliminating the EGC altogether, 250.122(A) still requires the raceway to be compliant with 250.122(A)(5)and 250.122(B)(4).
Thank you.
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Ekbrunn, sorry I don't buy your reasoning.

The EGC has been increased proportionatly in overall size.

We have not increased the overcurrent device so I wouldn't see a need to consider the EGC for overcurrent reasons.

I don't have a 250.122(A)(5) or a 250.122(B)(4) in my code book. :confused:

Roger

[ June 28, 2004, 12:15 PM: Message edited by: roger ]
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Roger,
My mistake. The references should have been for 250.4(A)(5) and 250.4 (B)(4).
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Ekbrunn, that makes a little more sense. ;)

For the conduit to be the EGC as allowed in 250.118, it would be a given that it would meet these two requirements.

Roger

[ June 28, 2004, 01:01 PM: Message edited by: roger ]
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Roger,
For the conduit to be the EGC as allowed in 250.118, it would be a given that it would meet these to requirements.
I don't agree that just because something is shown in 250.118 that automatic compliance with 250.4 is a given. With high available fault currents, even the conductor sizes in Table 250.122 do not comply with 250.4.
Don
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Don,
I don't agree that just because something is shown in 250.118 that automatic compliance with 250.4 is a given.
I think you read my post in reverse of the way I typed (meant) it, to be allowed by 250.118, 250.4 would have to be met before any other consideration.

Roger

[ June 28, 2004, 01:28 PM: Message edited by: roger ]
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

I have found that following only the article 250-122 for sizing EGC is not enough. This is just the minimum requirement for an EGC (see title to table 250-122) that you must choose. But if the ground fault available is high enough, the EGC chosen by table 250-122 generally will not be protected by the breaker. Remember that the EGC is permitted to be sized smaller than the phase conductors. If for high fault currents the breaker will not protect the phase conductors, the EGC will be even in worst shape. Sometimes, the breaker will protect the phase conductors for the available ground fault, but will not protect the EGC. The NEC establishes that all conductors should be protected against ANY current likely to be imposed on them, including high ground fault currents. So to make sure that you have specified the right EGC, you should know the available ground fault current, the ampere rating and time of operation of the breaker (for the ground fault current) and the damage characteristics (damage curve) of the EGC.

NEC 110.10 Circuit Impedance and Other Characteristics.
The overcurrent protective devices, the total impedance, the component short-circuit current ratings, and other characteristics of the circuit to be protected shall be selected and coordinated to permit the circuit-protective devices used to clear a fault to do so without extensive damage to the electrical components of the circuit. This fault shall be assumed to be either between two or more of the circuit conductors or between any circuit conductor and the grounding conductor or enclosing metal raceway.

NEC 240.1 Scope.
FPN: Overcurrent protection for conductors and equipment is provided to open the circuit if the current reaches a value that will cause an excessive or dangerous temperature in conductors or conductor insulation. See also 110.9 for requirements for interrupting ratings and 110.10 for requirements for protection against fault currents.

NEC 110.10 Circuit Impedance and Other Characteristics.
The overcurrent protective devices, the total impedance, the component short-circuit current ratings, and other characteristics of the circuit to be protected shall be selected and coordinated to permit the circuit-protective devices used to clear a fault to do so without extensive damage to the electrical components of the circuit. This fault shall be assumed to be either between two or more of the circuit conductors or between any circuit conductor and the grounding conductor or enclosing metal raceway

NEC Definitions:
Bonding (Bonded). The permanent joining of metallic parts to form an electrically conductive path that ensures electrical continuity and the capacity to conduct safely any current likely to be imposed.
 
Re: parallel raceway EGC size

Ekbrunn,
Yes I still believe 1 #4 in each raceway is compliant. Based on two sets of 4/0 phase conductors using simple ratio and proportion a conductor the size of one #1 meets 250.122(B). The two #4's required by section (F) are the equivalent CM of one #1. 250.122(F) is therefore complied with as well. The issue that Don and Corvalan brought up are valid but more information about the installation is required to determine if it's compliant under those engineering parameters.
 
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