Pigtail grounding screw dilema

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innersurffer

innersurffer

Member
Location
St Petersburg (Have lived in Lakeland, Miami, Ft L
If, for instance there is a 4" x 4" box that has a ground screw and a single device (i.e. receptacle) and there is 3 wires coming in (ground-green,neutral-white,and a hot-any color) should the device be attached to the ground by an old school method I learned along time ago of wrapping the green wire (ground) around the ground screw and leaving enough extra green wire to go directly to the ground screw of the device, or should it be pigtailed separately with a wire nut making 3 ground wires (0ne wire would be the ground coming in, one would be the ground from the ground screw, and one would be from the ground of the device)??? I prefer the second method just because of the ideal of the initial ground, if broken, would not potentially ground the box in the first situation. Can you give a code relating to the second method or have I been overdoing it for the last 7 years? Also, what if this situation was in a daisy chained series of receptacles?
 
S

southernboys

Senior Member
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

To me it would be easier and quicker to wrap the ground around the screw then hit the device. However if you have a green helper a great job for him is wrapping a green wire around ground screw in box then pigtail everything. It will keep him busy and you can concentrate on getting the job done. Rather then having to tell him 5 times how to make up a can light with quick connects on the wires.
 
LarryFine

LarryFine

Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
Location
Henrico County, VA
Occupation
Electrical Contractor
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

One wire to box then device.

For switches and other devices, I prefer pigtailing for, for example, replacing a switch with a dimmer, but for grounding, a single long wire is fine, because the connection should never need changing.
 
physis

physis

Senior Member
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

I like to leave the conductor from the cable or raceway long enough to get the device too. But you have to leave 6 inches of EGC in the box before it goes to the ground screw because of 300.14.
 
paul

paul

Senior Member
Location
Snohomish, WA
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

Either method is legal. I prefer to use self grounding recepts and then just hit the box with the ground.
 
H

hurk27

Senior Member
Location
Portage, Indiana NEC: 2008
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

I like the idea of not having another connection in the grounding conductor so I vote for longer grounding conductor hitting the screw then device. If connection to box is lost then the device is still connected to EGC.
 
infinity

infinity

Moderator
Staff member
Location
New Jersey
Occupation
Journeyman Electrician
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

I like to leave the conductor from the cable or raceway long enough to get the device too. But you have to leave 6 inches of EGC in the box before it goes to the ground screw because of 300.14.
Click to expand...
Sam I've heard this before about leaving 6" of conductor before hitting the ground screw in the box. But is this really required if I still have 6" after I hit the screw?
 
iwire

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

IMO Sam is correct.

300.14 Length of Free Conductors at Outlets, Junctions, and Switch Points.
At least 150 mm (6 in.) of free conductor, measured from the point in the box where it emerges from its raceway or cable sheath, shall be left at each outlet, junction, and switch point for splices or the connection of luminaires (fixtures) or devices. Where the opening to an outlet, junction, or switch point is less than 200 mm (8 in.) in any dimension, each conductor shall be long enough to extend at least 75 mm (3 in.) outside the opening.
Click to expand...
It does not say measured from the point it is terminated.
 
J

jimwalker

Senior Member
Location
TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

"However if you have a green helper a great job for him is wrapping a green wire around ground screw in box then pigtail everything. It will keep him busy and you can concentrate on getting the job done. Rather then having to tell him 5 times how to make up a can light with quick connects on the wires. "
Why even hire him ? I look at that type of help as just a drain on the project hours.They keep profits low and pay for the real workers low.Might just as well have him go get the wire stretcher.Not saying helpers are not needed but if they cant be taught how to wire a can in a few minutes then something is wrong.
 
S

southernboys

Senior Member
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

Jim if I had the option I would not have hired this kid. However I do not own the company. So therefore Im doing everything I can to teach him but some guys you just cant teach. My pm is aware of this and I hope to see a new heloer today. Ill put it to you like this. I told him bend me a loop in the wire to go into a fan box. Staple it so I can pull slack in. He does that just fine however he leaves the wire out of the box. Whereas I was green when I first started out I was never complacent or lazy. So in youalls opinion what is the easiest way to deal with a situation like this one, Hate to threadfjack
 
physis

physis

Senior Member
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

Well, if a thred has to take another direction, it might as well be south. :D
 
J

jimwalker

Senior Member
Location
TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

Hand him a shovel or a chipping hammer or keep his a$$ on a ladder all day.Do everything within the law to make him wanta quit.But please don't send him to Tampa. ;)
 
B

benaround

Senior Member
Location
Arizona
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

Paul,

My opinion of a self grounding recepticle is one that will ground the box from the recpt,not ground the grounding terminal of the recpt. from the box! Also 250.148 ,to me seems to suport that statement.

frank
 
iwire

iwire

Moderator
Staff member
Location
Massachusetts
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

Originally posted by benaround:
My opinion of a self grounding recepticle is one that will ground the box from the recpt,not ground the grounding terminal of the recpt. from the box!
Click to expand...
Frank you are looking at it backward.

You must always ground a metal outlet box.

If you use a self grounding receptacle you do not have to bring a grounding conductor to it.

If you did it your way the removal of the receptacle would lift the boxes ground which would be a 250.124 violation.
 
B

benaround

Senior Member
Location
Arizona
Re: Pigtail grounding screw dilema

ME TOO, Frank you really should get your head out of your assumtion and maybe put a foot or two in the place where the words come out.

Personally I pigtail everything,even self grounding recpts. ,to me it seems crazy to be within inches of the recpt. grounding terminal and not connect the EGC to the place where the cord plugs into,BUT that's not code

You know,I'm actualy starting to like being wrong!! NOT!!!!

frank
 
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