Please help
- Thread starter leah19104
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petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
Re: Please help
what makes you think there might be something wrong with it in the first place?
there are some known issues with certain models of panelboards, but just because it is a push style breaker does not make it bad.
if you gave us the brand and model number it would make it easier to give you better infomration.
what makes you think there might be something wrong with it in the first place?
there are some known issues with certain models of panelboards, but just because it is a push style breaker does not make it bad.
if you gave us the brand and model number it would make it easier to give you better infomration.
charlie tuna
Senior Member
- Location
- Florida
Re: Please help
there are thousands of these push-o-matic panels in operation just like yours -- guess what -- no problems!! they function just like any other breaker. biggest draw back is availability --- but they are available, just not too many supply houses carry them. and if that bothers you --- order a few replacement breakers to cover your needs...........
there are thousands of these push-o-matic panels in operation just like yours -- guess what -- no problems!! they function just like any other breaker. biggest draw back is availability --- but they are available, just not too many supply houses carry them. and if that bothers you --- order a few replacement breakers to cover your needs...........
Re: Please help
This is was was stated in the inspection report
A neutral wire was noted at a breaker in the main box. The neutral wire appears to be wired ?hot?. Upon further investigation, it appears that the neutral wire is part of the water heater wiring and the hot wire is wired to a separate breaker. We recommend contracting a licensed electrician to properly wire the water heater to the main panel box
Note: The water heater appears to be wired to a 20-amp breaker. During repairs, the wiring and breaker should be evaluated to determine whether additional repairs are needed.
This is was was stated in the inspection report
A neutral wire was noted at a breaker in the main box. The neutral wire appears to be wired ?hot?. Upon further investigation, it appears that the neutral wire is part of the water heater wiring and the hot wire is wired to a separate breaker. We recommend contracting a licensed electrician to properly wire the water heater to the main panel box
Note: The water heater appears to be wired to a 20-amp breaker. During repairs, the wiring and breaker should be evaluated to determine whether additional repairs are needed.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
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- engineer
Re: Please help
sounds to me like the inspection report is suggesting you get an electrician out to come take a look at the water heater wiring. it does not sound like the inspection report is objecting to the breaker panel at all.
follow the advice and get an electrician out there to take a look at the water heater wiring.
it sounds liek someone wired up the water heater with 2 wire Nm and ended up with a white wire on a breaker.
[ August 16, 2005, 11:01 AM: Message edited by: petersonra ]
sounds to me like the inspection report is suggesting you get an electrician out to come take a look at the water heater wiring. it does not sound like the inspection report is objecting to the breaker panel at all.
follow the advice and get an electrician out there to take a look at the water heater wiring.
it sounds liek someone wired up the water heater with 2 wire Nm and ended up with a white wire on a breaker.
[ August 16, 2005, 11:01 AM: Message edited by: petersonra ]
B
bthielen
Guest
Re: Please help
My impression is that since the white wire is terminated at a circuit breaker it is not a neutral and hence the issue with the inspector. By code definition, a white wire is supposed to represent a grounded conductor and the fact that this wire is in fact not grounded or marked otherwise, raises an issue of concern. I share Roger's statement. If you want an accurate opinion, hire an electrician to take a look.
Bob
My impression is that since the white wire is terminated at a circuit breaker it is not a neutral and hence the issue with the inspector. By code definition, a white wire is supposed to represent a grounded conductor and the fact that this wire is in fact not grounded or marked otherwise, raises an issue of concern. I share Roger's statement. If you want an accurate opinion, hire an electrician to take a look.
Bob
- Location
- Lockport, IL
- Occupation
- Semi-Retired Electrical Engineer
Re: Please help
More to the point, as you are the prospective buyer, I believe it is within your rights to require the owner to have an electrician take a look at this one aspect of the house wiring. The building inspector made the comment, so it is up to the owner (seller) to make it right, or to prove that it is already right.
It may also be in your interests (but I don't think you can make the seller pay for this) to have an electrician do an inspection of the whole house. If any code violations or design weaknesses are noted, then you can place them on the negotiation table, as you present your offer.
Perhaps one of the electricians on this Forum can give you a rough idea of what it might cost for an electrical inspection.
More to the point, as you are the prospective buyer, I believe it is within your rights to require the owner to have an electrician take a look at this one aspect of the house wiring. The building inspector made the comment, so it is up to the owner (seller) to make it right, or to prove that it is already right.
It may also be in your interests (but I don't think you can make the seller pay for this) to have an electrician do an inspection of the whole house. If any code violations or design weaknesses are noted, then you can place them on the negotiation table, as you present your offer.
Perhaps one of the electricians on this Forum can give you a rough idea of what it might cost for an electrical inspection.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
Re: Please help
If you hire an electrician to do an inspection, he may have some set fee for inspections, or he may want to charge by the hour. It would take a LOT of time to do an exhaustive inspection, and probably not worth the effort IMO.
I would suggest if you do it, pay him for a service call and one hour to poke around and see what he thinks before moving any farther. He should be able to give you some idea about the electrical wiring in an hour's time.
Then you can have the plumber, carpenter, roofer, exterminator, septic guy, and mason come in and pay them a similar amount to inspect their little chunk of the house.
or you can accept the HI's cursory look-see. if this is the worst thing on the HI's list, you are probably in good shape.
buying a house is a crap shoot, but one biased in your favor. most of the time there is nothing seriously wrong, but sometimes something slips by both you and the HI. that's why he has insurance. if it really bothers you, i think you can get a warranty for some fraction of the cost of the house that will indemnify you against these kinds of problems.
My guess is that you would be spinning your wheels. if you want the house and there are no obvious serious problems buy it. If you screw around too long the seller will find someone else.
If you hire an electrician to do an inspection, he may have some set fee for inspections, or he may want to charge by the hour. It would take a LOT of time to do an exhaustive inspection, and probably not worth the effort IMO.
I would suggest if you do it, pay him for a service call and one hour to poke around and see what he thinks before moving any farther. He should be able to give you some idea about the electrical wiring in an hour's time.
Then you can have the plumber, carpenter, roofer, exterminator, septic guy, and mason come in and pay them a similar amount to inspect their little chunk of the house.
or you can accept the HI's cursory look-see. if this is the worst thing on the HI's list, you are probably in good shape.
buying a house is a crap shoot, but one biased in your favor. most of the time there is nothing seriously wrong, but sometimes something slips by both you and the HI. that's why he has insurance. if it really bothers you, i think you can get a warranty for some fraction of the cost of the house that will indemnify you against these kinds of problems.
physis
Senior Member
Re: Please help
I was just out with a friend looking for a "good" used car. At a rental car company no less. I offered to take her around to look at other places.
Her reply: how do I know I wont get some rebuilt car that was only bought by someone to repair and sell. Or some other piece of junk.
You don't know.
There are no perfect buildings or cars or anything else.
You can hire a reputable inspection company and they might miss something. Like a building I worked on recently. All of these inspections, $200,000.00 worth of repairs. Another company comes along and finds that the foundation also needs $80,000.00 to $100,000 of repair.
Maybe buy a new building. Much lower quality in my opinion, but you'll have a warranty. I've known people with these warranties.
The best thing to do might be to just be reasonable about your approach to finding a good house and keep some money available for things that might need to be repaired.
I was just out with a friend looking for a "good" used car. At a rental car company no less. I offered to take her around to look at other places.
Her reply: how do I know I wont get some rebuilt car that was only bought by someone to repair and sell. Or some other piece of junk.
You don't know.
There are no perfect buildings or cars or anything else.
You can hire a reputable inspection company and they might miss something. Like a building I worked on recently. All of these inspections, $200,000.00 worth of repairs. Another company comes along and finds that the foundation also needs $80,000.00 to $100,000 of repair.
Maybe buy a new building. Much lower quality in my opinion, but you'll have a warranty. I've known people with these warranties.
The best thing to do might be to just be reasonable about your approach to finding a good house and keep some money available for things that might need to be repaired.
- Location
- Windsor, CO NEC: 2017
- Occupation
- Service Manager
Re: Please help
I wouldn't let it dissuade me from purchasing a house.
I smell a home inspector.
I wouldn't let it dissuade me from purchasing a house.
stud696981
Senior Member
Re: Please help
I think the cost of an electrican doing an inspection will vary greatly. I for one would charge a service call plus my hourly rate. Depending on how many items you want me to probe and how deep we go would set the price.
However, I think an inspection of the service and a general walk of the house could be done with in an hour.
I think the cost of an electrican doing an inspection will vary greatly. I for one would charge a service call plus my hourly rate. Depending on how many items you want me to probe and how deep we go would set the price.
However, I think an inspection of the service and a general walk of the house could be done with in an hour.
Ken9876
Senior Member
- Location
- Jersey Shore
Re: Please help
I found out in my area that the town or county will do a resale electrical inspection for $20. I've gotten involved with these situations before and I'm licensed to do electrical work not inspect it.
I found out in my area that the town or county will do a resale electrical inspection for $20. I've gotten involved with these situations before and I'm licensed to do electrical work not inspect it.
petersonra
Senior Member
- Location
- Northern illinois
- Occupation
- engineer
Re: Please help
That's an interesting point. Does one need an inspector license to inspect electrical work for pay? I wonder.
That's an interesting point. Does one need an inspector license to inspect electrical work for pay? I wonder.
jeff43222
Senior Member
- Location
- Minneapolis, Minnesota
Re: Please help
The only "inspector license" in these parts is a city license to be a home inspector. These people can do inspections for buyer/sellers and are also the ones who file the Truth-In-Housing report required before a house can be put on the market. But since their inspections cover everything in the house, they only look for the obvious stuff. For the electrical part of the inspection, they generally just look for flying splices, unjumpered water meters, receptacle boxes dangling from wires, etc.
If it's determined that the electrical system needs a separate inspection of its own, it has to be done by a state-licensed EC.
I happened to talk with one of these guys yesterday after he told a homeowner that some K&T splices needed to be put in j-boxes. I mentioned that tape-n-solder was how it was done back in the old days, and he told me he was only requiring j-boxes for the splices that were done more recently (e.g., one had a new wire nut peeking out from under the tape).
[ August 18, 2005, 10:42 AM: Message edited by: jeff43222 ]
The only "inspector license" in these parts is a city license to be a home inspector. These people can do inspections for buyer/sellers and are also the ones who file the Truth-In-Housing report required before a house can be put on the market. But since their inspections cover everything in the house, they only look for the obvious stuff. For the electrical part of the inspection, they generally just look for flying splices, unjumpered water meters, receptacle boxes dangling from wires, etc.
If it's determined that the electrical system needs a separate inspection of its own, it has to be done by a state-licensed EC.
I happened to talk with one of these guys yesterday after he told a homeowner that some K&T splices needed to be put in j-boxes. I mentioned that tape-n-solder was how it was done back in the old days, and he told me he was only requiring j-boxes for the splices that were done more recently (e.g., one had a new wire nut peeking out from under the tape).
[ August 18, 2005, 10:42 AM: Message edited by: jeff43222 ]
james wuebker
Senior Member
- Location
- Iowa
Re: Please help
If I'm buying a $200 or $300,000 house paying someone a couple hundred bucks would hurt you in the long run. If you really like the house have an electrician come out and give it a good look over. This will take away all fears about the electrical on the house. You can work the cost in buying the house with the sellers most of the time.
Jim
If I'm buying a $200 or $300,000 house paying someone a couple hundred bucks would hurt you in the long run. If you really like the house have an electrician come out and give it a good look over. This will take away all fears about the electrical on the house. You can work the cost in buying the house with the sellers most of the time.
Jim
jimwalker
Senior Member
- Location
- TAMPA FLORIDA
Re: Please help
So exactly what all can an unlicensed electrician offer to do ? Could he maybe offer to give a better electrical inspection than average HI ? And can a licensed HI remove a panel cover ? In this case i think all that is needed is a piece of black tape on that white wire.Note he did not say wrong size wire or breaker just that he seen a white wire.See this often even on new houses.Many electricians only hear they can use the white as hot and forget about remarking.
Bottom line is this inspection is only as good as the man or woman doing it.
So exactly what all can an unlicensed electrician offer to do ? Could he maybe offer to give a better electrical inspection than average HI ? And can a licensed HI remove a panel cover ? In this case i think all that is needed is a piece of black tape on that white wire.Note he did not say wrong size wire or breaker just that he seen a white wire.See this often even on new houses.Many electricians only hear they can use the white as hot and forget about remarking.
Bottom line is this inspection is only as good as the man or woman doing it.
Ken9876
Senior Member
- Location
- Jersey Shore
Re: Please help
Not in NJ they license from A to Z, I'm approaching these situations differently now, I can't see behind the wall, can't or wouldn't want to guarantee anything in the house. And there is the whole sue happy society we live in. I try to remember your the last one that was in the house, if anything should happen. and that's who their going to go after.
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