Point of Use AFCI?GFCI

[ptonsparky]

Watch now...

Interesting viewpoint but I don't know how that conforms to the NEC requirements for new construction.

Sure would solve the problem we have with older appliances that don't conform to the newer standards or are just plain faulty.

I believe I will try one of these on an older home that has a sporadic trip of the AFCI. Series Arc according to the diagnostics on the CB, but which appliance?

 

[mbrooke]

If these can't feed through Id imagine the cost would sky rocket for a new home or remodel.

 

[user 100]

If these can't feed through Id imagine the cost would sky rocket for a new home or remodel.

They are capable of feed thru and are a cheaper solution for older houses w/ panels that cannot accommodate afci breakers- to conform with 210.12(B)(2)

For new construction there is always 210.12(A)(5)......

They would seem to help narrow down ghosts when used as a troubleshooting tool.

 

[ptonsparky]

If these can't feed through Id imagine the cost would sky rocket for a new home or remodel.

They are point of use.

I thought the reason for AFCIs were because you ropers were doing such a bad job of stapling and beating the stuffing out of it that homeowners were needing protection from the CB on.

Now they are going to switch or suggesting that maybe POU may be better?

 

[ptonsparky]

They are capable of feed thru and are a cheaper solution for older houses w/ panels that cannot accommodate afci breakers- to conform with 210.12(B)(2)

For new construction there is always 210.12(A)(5)......

They would seem to help narrow down ghosts when used as a troubleshooting tool.

I did not see load connections on the device installed but there may be other styles.

 

[user 100]

I did not see load connections on the device installed but there may be other styles.

The Legrand product is listed for feed thru - guys thumb was covering up load side terminal in vid.

 

[ptonsparky]

The Legrand product is listed for feed thru - guys thumb was covering up load side terminal in vid.

Yup, I see the label now.

 

[brycenesbitt]

Hmmm... what's the vampire power loss on these point of use AFCI's, compared to a panel based AFCI?

 

[peter d]

Hmmm... what's the vampire power loss on these point of use AFCI's, compared to a panel based AFCI?

Good question, they do get warm so I think a whole panel of them could easily heat a garage or basement.

 

[tom baker]

Originally the device (outlet) manufacturers had no piece of the pie on AFCIs as the requirement was for branch circuit protection. Since they have been able to provide outlet type AFCIs, they now are claiming better protection than a circuit breaker...

 

[Sierrasparky]

Originally the device (outlet) manufacturers had no piece of the pie on AFCIs as the requirement was for branch circuit protection. Since they have been able to provide outlet type AFCIs, they now are claiming better protection than a circuit breaker...

Yes , But what about for new construction where you have to protect the whole circuit?
As far as I am aware there still is no listed breaker to go with these so you can use a paired breaker and the receptacle in the first outlet. (210.12 exception 3 or 4)????:?

 

[al hildenbrand]

They are point of use.

I thought the reason for AFCIs were because you ropers were doing such a bad job of stapling and beating the stuffing out of it that homeowners were needing protection from the CB on.

In my opinion, the dual function (AFCI/GFCI) Outlet Branch Circuit (OBC) receptacle device that you show in the OP video finds use only in modifications of existing branch circuits and/or replacement of existing receptacle devices. That is, new construction of new branch circuits are not served by this device.

Now they are going to switch or suggesting that maybe POU may be better?

In my opinion, the dual function OBC is the missing link in an economical solution for replacing an existing worn or damaged receptacle device in any location in, an existing dwelling, that requires both AFCI protection and GFCI protection.

I can go to a client's home, a home wired with an ungrounded wiring method, and provide receptacle replacement of existing two wire nongrounding type devices with this dual function OBC, label it "No Equipment Ground" and be done. It won't matter what the overcurrent protective device is as I won't have to replace it.

 

[brantmacga]

They are point of use.

I thought the reason for AFCIs were because you ropers were doing such a bad job of stapling and beating the stuffing out of it that homeowners were needing protection from the CB on.

Now they are going to switch or suggesting that maybe POU may be better?

Yeh...... I thought the whole point, from an NEC standpoint and from all the marketing materials showing nails and staples being driven into romex, was premises wiring protection?


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[peter d]

AFCI's only get installed when permits and inspections are involved. :thumbsup: