Preferred Installation Method

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czars

Czars
Location
West Melbourne, FL
Occupation
Florida Certified Electrical Contractor
Remodeling an old house with concrete block walls, 1x2 furring strips and drywall. Old wallboard has been removed along with some of the furring strips. Block walls are knocked out behind outlet and switches boxes. I would like to hear about your preferred method for installing wiring for wall outlets and switches.
 
I would frame the walls out with either 2 1/2" or 3 5/8" metal studs and install standard boxes and cable. Are these new walls going to be insulated?
 
I have done two different methods. If the blocks are hollow I would fish my cable down the block and nail to the furring. Some times I have to add my own piece of wood to nail to.

I have also run the cable on the outside of the block and again knocked the hole into the block to recess my box.

Back in the old days we had to use UF when installed in the void of the blocks but art. 334.10(A)(2) clearly allows NM cable. If the walls are very damp I might still use UF.

I also like to sleeve the cable in emt for a little extra protection.
 
To me furring strip basement walls are archaic. If you're really looking to save space use 1 5/8" metal studs. Bashing holes in the foundation is IMO a poor idea.
 
infinity said:
To me furring strip basement walls are archaic. If you're really looking to save space use 1 5/8" metal studs. Bashing holes in the foundation is IMO a poor idea.
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I agree but there have been times -- years ago--- where we did not have those options. Today I demand at least 1 1/2" or more.
 
1900 boxes with mudrings surface mounted then use 1 1/2 firing strips or 2x4s layed flat against wall. If you dont like anchoring to the wall, you can use boxes with mounting tabs and screw directly to the firing strips.
 
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Thanks for the replies. Here in Brevard county Florida it is acceptable to staple the NM-B to the sides of the 1x2 furring strips or to the 1 1/2 side of a 2x4 mounted flat as a furring strip. That doesn't seem to provide any protection all all to the wiring. What is done in other locations??
 
czars said:
Thanks for the replies. Here in Brevard county Florida it is acceptable to staple the NM-B to the sides of the 1x2 furring strips or to the 1 1/2 side of a 2x4 mounted flat as a furring strip. That doesn't seem to provide any protection all all to the wiring. What is done in other locations??
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Article 300.5(D) should give the answer. As I said before I usually sleeve the wire in a conduit. The wire must be at least 1 1/4" back from the stud. That would be hard to maintain with a 2x4 on side.
 
ultramegabob said:
1900 boxes with mudrings surface mounted then use 1 1/2 firing strips or 2x4s layed flat against wall. If you dont like anchoring to the wall, you can use boxes with mounting tabs and screw directly to the firing strips.
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1900 boxes seem a lot of boxes to install in a basement.

It seems to me that maybe a couple dozen 4" sq boxes would be sufficient for a basement
 
roger3829 said:
1900 boxes seem a lot of boxes to install in a basement.

It seems to me that maybe a couple dozen 4" sq boxes would be sufficient for a basement
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You're a funny man. Many of our members have no clue what a 1900 box is. An old catalog number, I believe, for the 4 " square boxes. Term is never used g=here in NC -- only us northerns know that term. ;)
 
Dennis Alwon said:
You're a funny man. Many of our members have no clue what a 1900 box is. An old catalog number, I believe, for the 4 " square boxes. Term is never used g=here in NC -- only us northerns know that term. ;)
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Thanks.:smile:

I figured that it must be a part number for a box, whose brand?

In my area our supplier has steel city boxes and those are the only numbers that i'm familar with.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
Article 300.5(D) should give the answer. As I said before I usually sleeve the wire in a conduit. The wire must be at least 1 1/4" back from the stud. That would be hard to maintain with a 2x4 on side.
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I agree, but you could always attach it to the block with an 1.25" space away from the 2X4 on it's side.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
You're a funny man. Many of our members have no clue what a 1900 box is. An old catalog number, I believe, for the 4 " square boxes. Term is never used g=here in NC -- only us northerns know that term. ;)
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Correct, you are......:

old_1900prices.jpg

If the house has concrete block (CMUs, if you like), then 'round here, the house is 30 years old. No one makes new foundations out of blocks anymore. Thet's so, 80's.

So if you use furring strips on a block wall, your finish wall is going to be as crooked, bowed, twisted and out-of-square as the foundation.
 
Doing electrical work when the finish material is 1/2" drywall on 3/4" lath has always been a special challenge. My old method was to use Kruse straps with metal gangable Gem boxes, and bash holes in the block where necessary. There's nothing wrong with that tried and true method. It certainly worked for decades for the long-dead electricians. There are some new materials you should know about, however.

I like to use the special stackers, SIFS-1, which are designed for use on 3/4" lath, and they hold the NM cable the required distance away from the framing:
sifs-1.jpg


I also like to use the nonmetallic boxes that Arlignton makes, especially for 1/2" drywall on 3/4" lath that is on block walls. Part #FX121. They're the cat's meeow:
fx121.jpg
 
Carlon makes a 4" square blue plastic box (or should I have said non 1900?) and one and two gang 1/2" rise rings. The boxes have 1/2" ko's made from the same plastic material. Used in conjuntion with snap in plastic romex connectors you can get the whole wad in with over 24 cu. inches of box room. So a furring of 2"x2" or 2"x4" flat side is good enough to get flush finish to sheetrock. I buy 10' long x 1-1/2" wide 12 guage steel strips in bundles of 300' about twice a year for running protection over the cables verticle up the sides of the furring studs. Metal is secured on the outside edge with those flat head 1/2" roofing nails we all hate to get in our tires. With this method you keep the room shrinkage down to a minimum, and no need to clobber the concrete wall.
 
macmikeman said:
With this method you keep the room shrinkage down to a minimum, and no need to clobber the concrete wall.
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I guess some of you guys have it nice. I don't get to dictate how the room is framed or furred.
 
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