Pull Box, 36" x 36" w/480V motor branch circuit - Article 110.26 and T110.26(A)(1)

[petersonra]

The way the contract is written, I have authority to make this call. Construction is required to make the change - on their own ticket.

Hmm. The contract allows you to make arbitrary decisions like this? What kind of idiot contractor would go along with that?

 

[petersonra]

Attitudes like this are usually the result of a mixture between lack of experience and an inflated sense of authority. I feel bad for the crew who has to deal with him but in my experience guys like this don't stick around too long


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they typically get shifted some place (some times out the door) where they won't do as much damage.

 

[charlie b]

A few on this thread have attempted to throw-down the 'semantics card' - nope, that wont work either.

This is not about semantics. It’s about what the code says, and what the code does not say. So let me toss a different card on the table. It’s called “Charlie’s Rule.” Look it up on this forum.

FYI - I have instructed the construction manager on this project to 'rip this installation to shreds' - i.e. start over and provide minimum 30" of frontal working space on the grounds it is inherently unsafe.

IF you were as familiar with the NEC as you appear to believe yourself to be, then you would know that if the box contains 480 volt equipment, the minimum working clearance is 42 inches.

 

[Carultch]

This is not about semantics. It’s about what the code says, and what the code does not say. So let me toss a different card on the table. It’s called “Charlie’s Rule.” Look it up on this forum.

Are you the namesake of Charlie's rule? Or is it because Mike Holt's real first name is Charles?

 

[ADub]

they typically get shifted some place (some times out the door) where they won't do as much damage.

Where I work they get promoted. But not like a real promotion but more like management will create a position where the guy can be as ignorant as he wants but can't interfere with production.

 

[charlie b]

Are you the namesake of Charlie's rule?

Guilty, as charged. :happyyes:

 

[don_resqcapt19]

I thought the Code required it to be safe - anything is possible.

Yes but the code has to draw lines somewhere.

90.1 Purpose
(A) Practical Safeguarding. The purpose of this Code is the practical safeguarding of persons and property from hazards
arising from the use of electricity. This Code is not intended as a design specification or an instruction manual for untrained
persons.

It is not practical to provide safeguards for every possible hazard.

 

[Dale001289]

Attitudes like this are usually the result of a mixture between lack of experience and an inflated sense of authority. I feel bad for the crew who has to deal with him but in my experience guys like this don't stick around too long


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Been around for 38 years with many more to go, this industry is blessed to have someone like me. I'm not an old goat who follows his master around blindly, I actually have the capability to think on my own.

 

[Dale001289]

Hmm. The contract allows you to make arbitrary decisions like this? What kind of idiot contractor would go along with that?

The smart kind who yields to a higher level of intellect - mine.

 

[Dale001289]

This is not about semantics. It’s about what the code says, and what the code does not say. So let me toss a different card on the table. It’s called “Charlie’s Rule.” Look it up on this forum.
IF you were as familiar with the NEC as you appear to believe yourself to be, then you would know that if the box contains 480 volt equipment, the minimum working clearance is 42 inches.

Yes....I'm familiar with clearances - but this is NOT a typical scenario now is it? In other words you have to be smart enough to see shades of grey between the black and the white. This is where abstract thought process takes place. And that's why I consider myself to be the best in the business.

 

[Dale001289]

It appears you are feeling indignant that no one supported your interpretation.

Now you are going to take it out on the construction guys? :happysad:

Is there an AHJ involved? If yes, what are they saying?

Don't blame me if I happen to be just a little smarter than everyone else on this thread. The AHJ on this project comes to me for advice and interpretation -- not only for NEC but for all matters of wiring and installation -- this is called 'Trust' - based on an impeccable history of safety. Add timely completions along with superlative quality and results leave little room for dissent wouldn't you say?

 

[tkb]

The smart kind who yields to a higher level of intellect - mine.

Don't blame me if I happen to be just a little smarter than everyone else on this thread. The AHJ on this project comes to me for advice and interpretation -- not only for NEC but for all matters of wiring and installation -- this is called 'Trust' - based on an impeccable history of safety. Add timely completions along with superlative quality and results leave little room for dissent wouldn't you say?

So so then your arrogance does surpass your ignorance.

 

[kwired]

All those on this string (other than myself, of course) have been brainwashed into thinking the NEC is a cut and dry set of rules - it is not, the NEC is, at least to some degree, abstract, requiring judgment, thought process, assessment and evaluation to determine what is and isn't safe. A few on this thread have attempted to throw-down the 'semantics card' - nope, that wont work either.
FYI - I have instructed the construction manager on this project to 'rip this installation to shreds' - i.e. start over and provide minimum 30" of frontal working space on the grounds it is inherently unsafe.

There are many places in NEC that are not cut and dry, but it is our desire as installers to try to make it cut and dry, otherwise you have no clear choices if there are no boundaries to your options in a situation. You are certainly allowed to exceed NEC requirements, if you want some clearance that NEC doesn't specifically require you can include it in your design. An inspector using NEC as his basis will not fail it because you went beyond minimum requirements, but also would have approved less.

Yes....I'm familiar with clearances - but this is NOT a typical scenario now is it? In other words you have to be smart enough to see shades of grey between the black and the white. This is where abstract thought process takes place. And that's why I consider myself to be the best in the business.

Not typical for some people, very typical for others.

 

[ADub]

The smart kind who yields to a higher level of intellect - mine.

Your very first post on this thread pretty much shoots that theory down. Your question was fairly elementary.

 

[dkidd]

Please don't feed the troll.

 

[iwire]

Don't blame me if I happen to be just a little smarter than everyone else on this thread.

And with that said your thread is closed.