Pumps in pond supplying waterfall...

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billygoat58

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Medina Ohio USA
Somewhat of an oddball...working at a home and HO had a failure with one of two pumps that supply water from pond to waterfall (pumps are application correct and reside in crocks). Not my original work and need to replace one of the units (with like type). So far so good...what I don't like is original contractor had cord(s) from unit to shore without any protection for cord (rocks were placed on cord(s) to hide from shore through water to crock and yes, there was substantial nicking/damage to cord). I'd think using some type of cord cover would provide a better / safer /longer life application, but can't find a proper guide. My thought was to use liquid tight as we've done this before at homes to protect comm cables, irrigation cables, etc from damage by (mostly) landscapers. Has anyone had a similar situation and solution?
 
No.
The pumps I've done were for dripping signage (remember when that was all the rage?) and the pumps were in a crock hidden behind a wall.
 
I take it they are plug-in cords with molded ends, plugged into a GFCI receptacle? If so, the only way you could get seal-tite around it would be to cut off and replace that molded plug with a weathertite cord cap, and in doing so you own that pump from a warranty standpoint because if anything happens to it from then on, the pump mfr can say it was altered.

I did ponds and waterfalls for a while as a side job for a landscaper room mate. The problem is that although you don’t see it, the rocks are always vibrating just a little, so yes, it wears through the cord insulation eventually. What I did was to use heat shrink tubing large enough to go over the mounded plug end, then shrink it down even though it usually didn’t get all the way down to the cord. That left a first line of defense in that after a few years you can inspect that tubing and it it wears through, cut it off and replace it without having to replace the cord. Just make sure to use the heat shrink tube WITHOUT the mastic sealer! The nice thing about that too is that if the rocks are brown or gray, you can get brown or gray heat shrink tube.
 
Ok, try rubber wire way, or we use cable protectors you can drive over ~$120 ea. has a flip open top.
The wire way is cheap ~$20 from the home despot.
 
any rubber/plastic cord will eventually degrade over time outside.
perhaps run 600v S cord inside liquidtight or jacketed metallic to protect the cord?
but consider water and yearly temps, if it gets cold enough to freeze then perhaps drill 1/8" holes in conduit to perforate it so water cannot fully stand inside.

if so inclined, they make expanding fiberglass jacketing like Techflex, but if the length is long it could be a pita.

Even the use of polyurethane tubing can server to protect the cord.
 
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Saw a guy one time use those split tubes that offices like to use for putting their wires through.. the ones that look like flex conduit... said it stopped wires from being pinched by stones if cats and dogs moved them but did not build up water if he remembered to leave the split to the bottom..
 
Adamjamma said:
Saw a guy one time use those split tubes that offices like to use for putting their wires through.. the ones that look like flex conduit... said it stopped wires from being pinched by stones if cats and dogs moved them but did not build up water if he remembered to leave the split to the bottom..
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We call that split loom.

b6dd0a68d60ae706f83ad13c170ce367.jpg
 
Jraef said:
I take it they are plug-in cords with molded ends, plugged into a GFCI receptacle? If so, the only way you could get seal-tite around it would be to cut off and replace that molded plug with a weathertite cord cap, and in doing so you own that pump from a warranty standpoint because if anything happens to it from then on, the pump mfr can say it was altered. .
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Interesting. In the UK, cutting off a moulded plug and connecting to a fixed wiring point (fused connection unit) or fitting a re-wire able plug has been proven to NOT be a good enough reason for a manufacturer to void a warranty.
 
AdrianWint said:
Interesting. In the UK, cutting off a moulded plug and connecting to a fixed wiring point (fused connection unit) or fitting a re-wire able plug has been proven to NOT be a good enough reason for a manufacturer to void a warranty.
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I even remember a few times that we had to replace the plugs for certification.. old plugs did not have fuses... had to have fuses for certification under the inspection rules... even though there was a fuse in the main tool..lol...
 
AdrianWint said:
Interesting. In the UK, cutting off a moulded plug and connecting to a fixed wiring point (fused connection unit) or fitting a re-wire able plug has been proven to NOT be a good enough reason for a manufacturer to void a warranty.
Click to expand...

Adamjamma said:
I even remember a few times that we had to replace the plugs for certification.. old plugs did not have fuses... had to have fuses for certification under the inspection rules... even though there was a fuse in the main tool..lol...
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It is nonsense over here. Many times we need a different type of connector and the unit does not have that option, so we can be held liable for changing it. Crazy.
 
split loom is a ez to apply cover, but likely no match for a rock pinch. that style of wire loom is rather soft plastic. but, if say you covered 600v S cord then perhaps that is good enough. but it does not sound like a cord replacement is on the to-do list, just want to protect whats there.

the wall thickness of liquidtight provides some decent protection from abrasion and pinching.

i think it boils down to how much of a pita do you want to endure. the bigger the pita the more protection the end result will yield.

i mentioned earlier the NuLine jacketed coated metal flex. metal flex might be bad long term due to chafing of rubber cord on the metal flex inside. likely not a lot, but over time perhaps. best to stick with rubber/plastic flex.
 
My comment about cutting off the plug is specific to my submersible pond pump experiences. Changing the plug on the end of a power tool, portable fan etc. is one thing, changing it on a submersible pond pump is another. I know from personal experience that Little Giant, one of the biggest suppliers of pond pumps, will not honor the warranty of a pump that has had any alteration to the wiring, including cutting off the plug at the end. As to needing to do that for hard wiring, here in the US we cannot use portable cord for permanent installations, so that would be a moot point.

But hey, you can do whatever you like and find out for yourself...
 
Jraef said:
My comment about cutting off the plug is specific to my submersible pond pump experiences. Changing the plug on the end of a power tool, portable fan etc. is one thing, changing it on a submersible pond pump is another. I know from personal experience that Little Giant, one of the biggest suppliers of pond pumps, will not honor the warranty of a pump that has had any alteration to the wiring, including cutting off the plug at the end. As to needing to do that for hard wiring, here in the US we cannot use portable cord for permanent installations, so that would be a moot point.

But hey, you can do whatever you like and find out for yourself...
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It happens on a lot of equipment.
 
Thank you to all who read and supplied their thoughts and ideas to my question. Some good info was gleaned through your replies and although I'm still not sure of what I'll use, there will be some type of wrap applied for extra protection. And to all that mentioned the warranty being voided by cutting the original cord/plug, yes indeed it is stipulated on this pumps (Atlantic / Tidal Wave brand) literature as regards to warranty. Will update once a solution has been decided on and thank you again to all!
 
Jraef said:
As to needing to do that for hard wiring, here in the US we cannot use portable cord for permanent installations, so that would be a moot point.
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In alot of UK hotel rooms it is common to cut off the plug of the TV, kettle, fridge etc and wire these into a "flex outlet" - a particular accessory specifically designed to form the connection between the fixed building wiring (eg. your romex) and the flexible cord of an appliance. The idea is to make it harder for the device to be stolen or moved.

A fixed wall mounted heater would also be connected to the supply this way. The flex outlet plate may also include a switch & a fuse.

Are you saying that such an arrangement is not permitted in the US? I'm not taking about the building wiring being in flexible cord, but the last couple of feet or so between the wiring concealed in the building fabric and a power using device/appliance.
 
Jraef said:
My comment about cutting off the plug is specific to my submersible pond pump experiences. Changing the plug on the end of a power tool, portable fan etc. is one thing, changing it on a submersible pond pump is another. I know from personal experience that Little Giant, one of the biggest suppliers of pond pumps, will not honor the warranty of a pump that has had any alteration to the wiring, including cutting off the plug at the end. As to needing to do that for hard wiring, here in the US we cannot use portable cord for permanent installations, so that would be a moot point.

But hey, you can do whatever you like and find out for yourself...
Click to expand...

FWIW, a submersible sump pump I had forty or so years ago included a thin plastic tube inside the rubber line cord that served as a pressure vent for the motor housing. Taping that up as part of the attachment cap replacement could well have caused problems down the line. And replacing the entire cord with a splice made in the submerged portion would have been very bad for the motor. :)
 
AdrianWint said:
In alot of UK hotel rooms it is common to cut off the plug of the TV, kettle, fridge etc and wire these into a "flex outlet" - a particular accessory specifically designed to form the connection between the fixed building wiring (eg. your romex) and the flexible cord of an appliance. The idea is to make it harder for the device to be stolen or moved.

A fixed wall mounted heater would also be connected to the supply this way. The flex outlet plate may also include a switch & a fuse.

Are you saying that such an arrangement is not permitted in the US? I'm not taking about the building wiring being in flexible cord, but the last couple of feet or so between the wiring concealed in the building fabric and a power using device/appliance.
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That was one of the biggest things I first thought was wrong in UK and still do not like seeing it... because the plug here in UK contains a fuse... the flex plate does not.. so your kettle that has a five amp fuse in the plug now has no fuse on it being wired direct... simply because the hotel does not want it stolen...
however, with PAT testing you are starting to see less of this
 
billygoat58 said:
Thank you to all who read and supplied their thoughts and ideas to my question. Some good info was gleaned through your replies and although I'm still not sure of what I'll use, there will be some type of wrap applied for extra protection. And to all that mentioned the warranty being voided by cutting the original cord/plug, yes indeed it is stipulated on this pumps (Atlantic / Tidal Wave brand) literature as regards to warranty. Will update once a solution has been decided on and thank you again to all!
Click to expand...

OK, I have to say it. How expensive a pump is it and how likely is it to fail? Is the warranty really an issue?
 
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