LarryFine
Master Electrician Electric Contractor Richmond VA
- Location
- Henrico County, VA
- Occupation
- Electrical Contractor
I think you should get paid now, and let the bureaucrats beat each other up as long as they want to.
Question about this contract
- Thread starter AzVoltage
- Start date
- Status
AzVoltage
Member
- Location
- Kearny, Arizona
Well I got word today that the HO and his new GC went in with their tails between their legs and pulled the proper permit for the inside remodel job. City called me the other day asking if this project was my job and was I trying to have the remodel done under my panel permit. I told them NO, of course, said I was tricked into this mess and I have nothing to do with the unpermitted work.
Well, the permit they pulled reads:
---------------------------------------------
WORK INVOLVES: STRUCT, ELEC, MECH, PLBG
RETENTION REQUIRED. NO - YES VOLUME ____ ***IF YES, ADD "RETENTION" FLAG!***
ZONING:............ R1-6
HILLSIDE:.......... NO
REVIEWER:.......... GBU
The existing dwelling shall be equipped with smoke detectors as required for new dwellings. The smoke detectors shall be interconnected and hardwired with the exceptions as stated in IRC R313.2.1.
DESCRIPTION OF WORK: MINOR INTERIOR REMODEL AND REPAIR OF CARPORT AND PATIO COVERS TO EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENCE PER APPROVED PLANS. REPLACING HVAC DUCTWORK WITH R-8 DUCTWORK. NEW AND ALTERED ELECTRICAL CIRCUITS. SMOKE DETECTORS REQUIRED AS NOTED ABOVE. THE UNPERMITTED METAL STRUCTURE ADDED ONTO THE REAR TO "BE REMOVED" (OWNERS CHOICE - OR PROVIDE ENGINEERED DRAWINGS.
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They had a $315.00 fee added on to their permit fees for "investigation of work performed without permit".
SO, lets see this guy try to make ME responsible for the electric code requirements now!! (outside of my panel job) I think the inspector coming and shutting it down was a good thing for me.
City also told me they would put it in writing once they pass the panel as to the reasons why they won't clear the property for Utility to connect.....the remodel work inside being performed and lack of trust due to the violation.
I asked the city manager, could you temp my panel with power if I disconnect the home's circuits? He replied, "SHOULD WE TRUST THIS GUY?"
Well, the permit they pulled reads:
---------------------------------------------
WORK INVOLVES: STRUCT, ELEC, MECH, PLBG
RETENTION REQUIRED. NO - YES VOLUME ____ ***IF YES, ADD "RETENTION" FLAG!***
ZONING:............ R1-6
HILLSIDE:.......... NO
REVIEWER:.......... GBU
The existing dwelling shall be equipped with smoke detectors as required for new dwellings. The smoke detectors shall be interconnected and hardwired with the exceptions as stated in IRC R313.2.1.
DESCRIPTION OF WORK: MINOR INTERIOR REMODEL AND REPAIR OF CARPORT AND PATIO COVERS TO EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY RESIDENCE PER APPROVED PLANS. REPLACING HVAC DUCTWORK WITH R-8 DUCTWORK. NEW AND ALTERED ELECTRICAL CIRCUITS. SMOKE DETECTORS REQUIRED AS NOTED ABOVE. THE UNPERMITTED METAL STRUCTURE ADDED ONTO THE REAR TO "BE REMOVED" (OWNERS CHOICE - OR PROVIDE ENGINEERED DRAWINGS.
-------------------------------
They had a $315.00 fee added on to their permit fees for "investigation of work performed without permit".
SO, lets see this guy try to make ME responsible for the electric code requirements now!! (outside of my panel job) I think the inspector coming and shutting it down was a good thing for me.
City also told me they would put it in writing once they pass the panel as to the reasons why they won't clear the property for Utility to connect.....the remodel work inside being performed and lack of trust due to the violation.
I asked the city manager, could you temp my panel with power if I disconnect the home's circuits? He replied, "SHOULD WE TRUST THIS GUY?"
Power Tech
Senior Member
- Location
- Lebec, California
Az, maybe electrical contractor is not your thing. Maybe you will do better in a different field of endevor. Perhaps this thing is not worth your energy. Thats a pretty sorry looking house. Where did you get the idea in the first place that you would make any real money working on a dump like that.
Perhaps I can show you what you need to be targeting for "service changes" and so forth. Go where the food is....
I like rich people, they write me checks.
It's just as easy to look for work in wealthy areas, that can pay your prices as it is to look in areas that don't have the ability to pay.
bradleyelectric
Senior Member
- Location
- forest hill, md
Can be interesting. I worked at a house yesterday that used to be the areas store. I was talking to the owner afterwards and he was telling me about the place and a friend of his that owns a pasta bar. Sounded delicious.
Legal fraud notwithstanding
Legal fraud notwithstanding
I handed this to my attorney brother, he states ' Any contractual agreement not signed and initialled in all apsects shall be deemed inadmissible in a court of law. Any alterations to a contract which violate a know legal standing is non-binding.
As noted by another member, the first sentence is your protection. The word 'DONE', included by the homeowner; shall be the homeowners downfall in a court of law.
And he quoted all sorts of federal ruling and other impressive mumbo jumbo..
Tom
Legal fraud notwithstanding
I handed this to my attorney brother, he states ' Any contractual agreement not signed and initialled in all apsects shall be deemed inadmissible in a court of law. Any alterations to a contract which violate a know legal standing is non-binding.
As noted by another member, the first sentence is your protection. The word 'DONE', included by the homeowner; shall be the homeowners downfall in a court of law.
And he quoted all sorts of federal ruling and other impressive mumbo jumbo..
Tom
dexterg
Member
- Location
- New Braunfels, TX
Run don't walk....as fast as you can away from this job. Your contract is null and void unless you initialled the change and both parties have a copy.
This is why you have the GC sign your contract, and only sign a GC's contract after having it reviewed and approved by your attorney.
Some jobs are profitable and some jobs are lessons. This one is going to be a lesson for you. As stated by many others in this thread...
1. Consult with a lawyer about this contract and situation. Have the lawyer draw up a standard contract for you. Don't allow clients to change your contract without consulting with your lawyer.
Don't have the completion of the contract dependent on an inspection. Inspectors are wild cards. You get paid for completion of the work. If the work fails inspection it is corrected as warranty work free of charge. This may vary by state. My contract reads that there is no warranty when the contract isn't paid in full.
2. Don't do any more work for this client until this contract is complete and paid for. If you have language in your contract regarding delay, you should have a fee for removing and replacing the service wire, as well as for restaging on the project. If you don't have any such language, it's another lesson.
3. Any future work is a new contract or Change Order. As you now know your client is unreliable. Require 100% in advance on any new work (if allowed in AZ). I hope you got an advance on this work.
4. Never remove installed materials on completed work. It is viewed as theft and will include more expensive lessons. You are probably covered on removing the service wiring because of possible copper theft.
I hope it works out for you. It wasn't innocent language that was added to your contract and IMO you misread the meaning of the language.
1. Consult with a lawyer about this contract and situation. Have the lawyer draw up a standard contract for you. Don't allow clients to change your contract without consulting with your lawyer.
Don't have the completion of the contract dependent on an inspection. Inspectors are wild cards. You get paid for completion of the work. If the work fails inspection it is corrected as warranty work free of charge. This may vary by state. My contract reads that there is no warranty when the contract isn't paid in full.
2. Don't do any more work for this client until this contract is complete and paid for. If you have language in your contract regarding delay, you should have a fee for removing and replacing the service wire, as well as for restaging on the project. If you don't have any such language, it's another lesson.
3. Any future work is a new contract or Change Order. As you now know your client is unreliable. Require 100% in advance on any new work (if allowed in AZ). I hope you got an advance on this work.
4. Never remove installed materials on completed work. It is viewed as theft and will include more expensive lessons. You are probably covered on removing the service wiring because of possible copper theft.
I hope it works out for you. It wasn't innocent language that was added to your contract and IMO you misread the meaning of the language.
AzVoltage
Member
- Location
- Kearny, Arizona
This one certainly was a lesson! I have since worked on rewording my contracts and DO NOT let any customer change a single letter.
The job was held up due to all the inspector's requirements (not electrical). Once they finish the other work, (plumbing, heating, sewer lines, etc) I will come in and finish the work that was specified on my contract. Luckily, the inspector is not requiring any additional electric work or bringing anything to code, with the exception of the smoke alarms. GC is installing these on a circuit I will provide for him.
What I have to see is if the customer will pay when all said and done. The plumber is having problems now with this owner. Inspector wants the sewer lines replaced and owner is trying to make the plumber responsible for this as well, even though his work was only to replumb the home (no drain work).
I'm wondering if the GC, the plumber, and myself are all caught in this same web owner has spun! All I can say is I will be happy when I can go finish the job, get my inspection done, and get out of there. (and hopefully get paid)!
Thanks!
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