red tag garage wiring

[spaarky1964]

I don"t type so well. I install residential charging stations for electric cars from volts to teslas. I installed a charger in an attached garage
in aresidential occupancy. the feed was a 310 wire nmc drilled through the center of the wall studs near the ceiling, then came down the c enter of the stud

 

[spaarky1964]

red tag garage wiring

My 1st post wasn"t finished when sent,must have hit a wrong key.
can nmc be ran exposed in a stud wall in an attached residential garage as long as it complies with 300.4and334.17 or does it have to be sleeved
in an approved conduit because it is supject to physical damage. A part time inspector in the juridiction of this install
is saying the wiring must be sleeved to a height of 7ft 6inches. he could not produce a code section for that claim. he then quoted 334.15B.
no amount of explaining could make him understand that physical damage is covered by 300.4.
I then just appease him covered the stud bay with a piece of drywall to a hieght of 7ft 6inch so the customer could use his charger.
The inspector then said that the whole garage would have to be drywalled. then he added that an existing receptacle in the garage
was not gfci protected and I would also have to fix that.

 

[electrofelon]

I would say that it ultimately it comes down to the AHJ's position on physical damage, but based on the wording of the NEC, you really should be able to get away with quite a bit when used in dwelling units and accessory structures. Here in Seattle, the part of 334.15 for exposed/surface routing of NM is deleted, however they specifically say that it is considered concealed if run thru bored holes, even if there is no wall covering

 

[Cavie]

He can not make you drywall the whole garage. You have protected the wires in question. recep must be GFI.

 

[newservice]

Where does Dick Elliot get his 'must be protected to a height of' from in the NEC? Thats a big old red tag.

 

[newservice]

I have to say , just looking at this, Id be a little concerned with it too and probly be looking closely at it. Are those cable staples for low voltage being used on the 10-3? Why are the cables bent at a 45 instead of squared off like the 10-3 is?

 

[Ponchik]

Your installation is fine, unless it is a local amendment or according to that particular inspector it is subject to physical damage.

 

[newservice]

Assuming his installation is fine, the inspector still has the right to look around and if there are problems elsewhere he can either cite the owner or ask the electrician to fix them, I believe. Knowing this I'd look around that garage before I started and quote it to fix problems.

 

[augie47]

I think YOUR install would be acceptable with most inspectors. Since the Code can't address every specific situation,how "subject to physical damage" is addressed unfortunately varies by inspector.

Beyond that point the inspector has a situation:
a. He has a location with Code violations
b. He may not have known the extent of the work you performed when the red tag was issued.
How this is handled will vary by jurisdiction, but in some case the inspector is required to address all the violations he sees.
Locally, we would red-tag the location, but it would be up to the owner to address violations beyond your work.

I would request a meeting with his supervisor to address the issue and ask that your work be evaluated on its own merit.

 

[newservice]

I think YOUR install would be acceptable with most inspectors. Since the Code can't address every specific situation,how "subject to physical damage" is addressed unfortunately varies by inspector.

Beyond that point the inspector has a situation:
a. He has a location with Code violations
b. He may not have known the extent of the work you performed when the red tag was issued.
How this is handled will vary by jurisdiction, but in some case the inspector is required to address all the violations he sees.
Locally, we would red-tag the location, but it would be up to the owner to address violations beyond your work.

I would request a meeting with his supervisor to address the issue and ask that your work be evaluated on its own merit.

And I would agree with that.

 

[augie47]

Assuming his installation is fine, the inspector still has the right to look around and if there are problems elsewhere he can either cite the owner or ask the electrician to fix them, I believe. Knowing this I'd look around that garage before I started and quote it to fix problems.

The red tag will give him that opportunity also.
That way it can be the "dang inspector's" fault and the electrician can be the "good guy" and fix the problems.
If the electrician points them out prior to the red tag, he is often just "crying wolf" to get work.

 

[peter d]

That was a totally bogus call by the inspector. :thumbsdown:

 

[Ponchik]

Not a big deal but he has misspelled "height"

 

[augie47]

That was a totally bogus call by the inspector. :thumbsdown:

In what respect ?
Did the violations not exist ? .....

I feel clarification is needed as to responsibility for addressing the deficiencies, but he should not ignore the violations.

 

[GoldDigger]

In what respect ?
Did the violations not exist ?
I feel clarification is needed as to responsibility for addressing the deficiencies, but he should not ignore the violations.

Including the supposed violation of putting sheetrock on only the stud bay containing the wires?

 

[jes25]

Not a big deal but he has misspelled "height"

I noticed that as well

 

[al hildenbrand]

A part time inspector in the juridiction of this install
is saying the wiring must be sleeved to a height of 7ft 6inches. he could not produce a code section for that claim. he then quoted 334.15B.

In my area, the exposed NMB in a garage gets a little close attention with 334.15(A) in mind.

The "closely follow the surface of the building finish" is interpreted to say that the horizontal hole to hole runs in the pictures of the OP are good yard tool hanging hooks, which, of course, exposes the NM to physical damage.

For what it's worth.

 

[GerryB]

He didn't actually write "sleeve", he wrote protect. I would tell the homeowner put something up to cover it. In my area one inspector said 4' and below had to be "covered". It could even be insulation. (this was a detached garage) He was strictly an EI and he passed it and said it was up to the HO and see you later.

 

[hurk27]

I don"t type so well. I install residential charging stations for electric cars from volts to teslas. I installed a charger in an attached garage
in aresidential occupancy. the feed was a 310 wire nmc drilled through the center of the wall studs near the ceiling, then came down the c enter of the stud

Tell Dick Elliot there is no such requirement, the only requirement here in Indiana (we have a state wide code) is that there must be wall surface on at least one side of the studs when running horizontal thru a wall space, Welcome to the forum and also from a local contractor from your area, I will PM you my phone number and I can tell you how to handle Hobart, They tend to play the "I'm above the state law" game.

I do see one thing which I can't say because I can't see the whole garage, but from the photo's I see the charger as hard wired to a 1900 box with out a means of disconnect within sight or a breaker lock, but like I said I can't see the rest of the circuit.

I will PM you my phone number so I can help you on how to deal with Hobart.

 

[newservice]

I install residential charging stations for electric cars from volts to teslas. I installed a charger in an attached garage
in aresidential occupancy. the feed was a 310 wire nmc drilled through the center of the wall studs near the ceiling, then came down the c enter of the stud


ok now i get it, '310 wire' is 10-3 NM.