Repair for the day: 240 to 120 volt service conversion.

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K8MHZ

K8MHZ

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Location
Michigan. It's a beautiful peninsula, I've looked
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Electrician
480sparky said:
So the township calls up the owner of the property to verify they hired the contractor named on the permit application?
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Part of the permit process will be an inspection. The inspector will quickly figure out what happened and has every reason not to allow a re-connect, and would kind of be up against the wall as it is the law that he must enforce, not logic or good will.

Also, not just any EC can do work in our township. They must be registered before they can even get a permit application. I don't know of any EC that would risk his registration by cheating the local system to swap that box.
 
480sparky

480sparky

Senior Member
Location
Iowegia
K8MHZ said:
Part of the permit process will be an inspection. The inspector will quickly figure out what happened and has every reason not to allow a re-connect, and would kind of be up against the wall as it is the law that he must enforce, not logic or good will.

Also, not just any EC can do work in our township. They must be registered before they can even get a permit application. I don't know of any EC that would risk his registration by cheating the local system to swap that box.
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Time to start changing the law then.
 
480sparky

480sparky

Senior Member
Location
Iowegia
K8MHZ said:
Better yet, time to enforce the law that requires landlords to keep their rental property up to certain code and safety standards. I have never been in favor of changing one law because others are not being enforced.
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Doesn't seem like that's gonna happen.
 
kwired

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
I would for short term at least have put a jumper in panel somehow (possibly just put it between poles of a 2 pole breaker) so you can at least energize the non working 120 volt circuits and eliminate extension cords. That leaves you with no 240 volt loads that will operate.
 
K8MHZ

K8MHZ

Senior Member
Location
Michigan. It's a beautiful peninsula, I've looked
Occupation
Electrician
kwired said:
I would for short term at least have put a jumper in panel somehow (possibly just put it between poles of a 2 pole breaker) so you can at least energize the non working 120 volt circuits and eliminate extension cords. That leaves you with no 240 volt loads that will operate.
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I'm not going to do that. I was wondering what would happen if she turned on the oven element. That would light up the dead receptacles through the element. Of course, not usable 120....just thinking out loud.
 
kwired

kwired

Electron manager
Location
NE Nebraska
K8MHZ said:
I'm not going to do that. I was wondering what would happen if she turned on the oven element. That would light up the dead receptacles through the element. Of course, not usable 120....just thinking out loud.
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It is going to do that anyway if she turns it on. By putting a jumper in there or better yet disconnect the oven from the breaker and replace with the jumper you are eliminating putting the resistance of the element in series with other loads.

Several times have run into this situation with electric water heaters when one line of the supply had been lost, water heater cools enough to call for heat and everything on the lost side of the panel is operating with the element in series with it.
 
K8MHZ

K8MHZ

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Location
Michigan. It's a beautiful peninsula, I've looked
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Electrician
ptonsparky said:
The jumper would work fine if you are in total control of the repair process. The landlord’s obviously highly skilled tech might not understand what is happening when he finally gets around to fixing things again.
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I am not even part of the repair process, let alone in total control. A jumper is not a legal fix, this is in a trailer park, the pedestal is older than God, half destroyed by heat and I really don't think jury rigging is the answer here. I will help by showing her how to make a big stink about this. I went to take pictures for the lady so she could be better prepared to deal with bureaucracy.

Don't take this personally, but I think sticking a jumper in the panel to 'fix' a hack in the pedestal is just one hack taking place of the other.

The trailer park is going to have to pull a permit and have a licensed EC that is registered with the township to the repair. The landlord will not have the option of sending a tech out to do any more band aid repairs.
 
480sparky

480sparky

Senior Member
Location
Iowegia
K8MHZ said:
I am not even part of the repair process, let alone in total control. A jumper is not a legal fix, this is in a trailer park, the pedestal is older than God, half destroyed by heat and I really don't think jury rigging is the answer here. I will help by showing her how to make a big stink about this. I went to take pictures for the lady so she could be better prepared to deal with bureaucracy.

Don't take this personally, but I think sticking a jumper in the panel to 'fix' a hack in the pedestal is just one hack taking place of the other.

The trailer park is going to have to pull a permit and have a licensed EC that is registered with the township to the repair. The landlord will not have the option of sending a tech out to do any more band aid repairs.
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A jumper in the trailer's panel will be a better 'hack' than one in the park's panel.
 
480sparky

480sparky

Senior Member
Location
Iowegia
K8MHZ said:
I follow you, but I am not in this trade to out hack people. And that's just my moral fiber. Add to that some very strict licensing and permit laws for further motivation to not jury rig.
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You, at least, would be 'in charge' of your temporary fix. Trailer parks have no authority over what the tenants do with their own property. And if you're going to bat for the HO in this case, maybe you'll end up being the one for fix the park's issue so you can easily remove your fix and make it all 10000000 times better when you're done.
 
synchro

synchro

Senior Member
Location
Chicago, IL
Occupation
EE
If there are any MWBC's then a jumper between both sides of a 2-pole breaker may allow overloading and possible damage to the neutral conductors. If there are separate neutrals for each branch circuit then obviously that problem does not exist.
At least in the short term you could give guidance to make sure the extension cords are adequately sized for the loads, and also distributed on the branch circuits and receptacles as best as they can. I'm guessing that you might have already done this.
Anyway, I commend your willingness to help out in this situation.
 
growler

growler

Senior Member
Location
Atlanta,GA
K8MHZ said:
I am not even part of the repair process, let alone in total control. A jumper is not a legal fix, this is in a trailer park, the pedestal is older than God, half destroyed by heat and I really don't think jury rigging is the answer here. I will help by showing her how to make a big stink about this. I went to take pictures for the lady so she could be better prepared to deal with bureaucracy.
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I have a bit of experience with trailer parks and I agree with you. You have already done everything that you can.

If the lady had contacted the park by email or text so she can document the length of time this problem had been on going that would help.

There is one thing, if they have any kids they can probably get more help from the health department that other departments. Having to use all those extension cords is considered a fire hazard. They can take drastic measures and call the power company to come and check it out and they will pull the meter as unsafe.
 
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