Residential Basement wiring questions

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KnobnTube said:
Well, I do appreciate all the input, but it sure deviates away from my questions a little too much.
Original:
Can I use #14 for the wiring? Or is it a requirement for #12?

Just looking for any NEC stipulations on the rooms taking a specific wire size?
Thanks again,
tom
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NEC doesn't prohibit #14 but some local codes around here will not allow it. Check with the AHJ.
 
My goodness, we took the OP's simple question and expounded into seven pages of tangential arguments!;) :grin: I'm surprised no one threw in the "Make sure you don't use more than ten receptacles on that circuit because...."

KnobnTube, I hope you were able to find your answer in all this mess. If it helps, I'd say the consensus is that 14 AWG copper is acceptacle in your situation.
 
S'mise said:
Wellcome ecox, good way to sum it up.

I'll stick with #12 myself. Yes, using #14 saves you money in copper and is easier to work with. But don't forget the smaller wires in your wall have higher resistance and will cost you slightly more in utility bills over the years.
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I think you'll be long dead and gone before you realize any savings on the utility bill.

Of course, you are free to do the math and prove me wrong :)
 
tallguy said:
Someone or another has a cost/benefit analysis somewhere... maybe in one of Celtic's spreadsheets? At any rate -- with today's copper prices, it just doesn't pay for itself.
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LOL...I may be anal, but not THAT anal :grin:
 
Two rooms? Could probably just do one 15amp on that. Maybe a puter in each room? Perhaps 240watts of lighting in each? An occasional vacuum plugged in while the puter is off and maybe the light is off in the other room.
 
Wasted Power in conductors

Wasted Power in conductors

haskindm said:
This is one of those old wives tails that needs to be stopped. How do you figure that the smaller wire is going to add to your energy costs? If the circuit is loaded to the point that voltage drop is even noticeable (unusual in a typical residential circuit) you will get less output from any resisitive load, but your energy consumption will be the same. The lumen output on an incandscent load may drop slightly, but the bulb will NOT consume more amperage in order to maintain the same output. A motor load will consume slightly hire amperage in order to try to maintain the rated HP output, but lamps and other resistive loads will just consume fewer amps mainataining the same total wattage consumption.
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I know we are not talking big numbers here, but the fact remains;
If the resistance of the wire is higher the more power is wasted in a circuit (Heat). Wasted power = Higher energy costs. Even when Voltage drop is small, there is a cost to be paid for those small wires in the wall. over the years this can add up. Unless you consider this wasted power a supplement to your heating bill.:grin:
 
S'mise said:
If the resistance of the wire is higher the more power is wasted in a circuit (Heat). Wasted power = Higher energy costs. Even when Voltage drop is small, there is a cost to be paid for those small wires in the wall. over the years this can add up.
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"This message was provided to you free of charge by Copper.org"

:D
 
wirebender said:
NEC doesn't prohibit #14 but some local codes around here will not allow it. Check with the AHJ.
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Huh?!? There are local codes in your area that prohibit #14 outright -- for residential? That seems truly bizarre... Is there a copper mine nearby?
 
Let,s see........pool table, pool requires beverage, beverage must be cold and not up stairs, coolers and ice........too messy, need fridge... also, big screen means sports, sports requires beverage, see above.

sports = beverage
pool = beverage

too much beverage = bathroom (not upstairs)

my man cave has 2 fridges, one keg cooler, poker table, office, full bath, overhead projector, 60" inch screen, plus furnace room and freezer and 2 puters, ones a juke box for the surround and one for the office

light is 4' troffer behind bar, 3 bar lights, 3 recess cans, dimmers over bar, 4 light fixture over poker table, to dimmable 3 bulb fixtures for side light for movies, light-heat-exhaust in full bath plus 3 light vanity, 6 15 and 20a oulet circuits plus phone and data and 4 egress windows.......my 200a panel is nearly full.

good luck with yours :cool:
 
tallguy said:
This post seems to have slipped past without comment...

Huh?!? There are local codes in your area that prohibit #14 outright -- for residential? That seems truly bizarre... Is there a copper mine nearby?
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Yes, I know of at least one municipality that doesn't allow #14 at all. No 15 amp circuits.
 
Good idea to do this yourself. I can assure your job will come out very well since it is your house and you will most likely want it to be perfect. Contractors including myself are always in a hurry and time is money. Not to say contractors don't do quality work, BUT.
You won't be under the gun so you can take your time a do a killer job. I agree on the #12 NM for the whole job. When I rewired my house I did not use any #14 or any 15 amp breakers.
Totally agree on getting with the AHJ first. Find out what THEY want. It doesn't have to be in the NEC for them to red tag a job. They do it all the time. Do whatever they tell you to as long as it is safe. And come back here for help if you need it. Have fun.
 
your frindly cooper agent

your frindly cooper agent

Mand, you guys have a lot of time on your hands to keep rambling about #12 or #14. Can we sum it up by saying 14 is ok, but 12 is better if you have deep pockets? No, your right, its more fun to debate until the cows come home. I'm betting Billsnuf has #12 in hisbasement
;)
 
S'mise said:
Mand, you guys have a lot of time on your hands to keep rambling about #12 or #14. Can we sum it up by saying 14 is ok, but 12 is better if you have deep pockets? No, your right, its more fun to debate until the cows come home. I'm betting Billsnuf has #12 in hisbasement
;)
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Sure we can, it would be a lie though. If you are comfortable with spreading BS nonsense then knock yourself out. :-?

If you want an even better job, go with all # 10. :rolleyes:
 
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John Valdes said:
Totally agree on getting with the AHJ first. Find out what THEY want. It doesn't have to be in the NEC for them to red tag a job. They do it all the time. Do whatever they tell you to as long as it is safe. And come back here for help if you need it. Have fun.
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I think I have no words for this. Wow.
 
John Valdes said:
It doesn't have to be in the NEC for them to red tag a job. They do it all the time. Do whatever they tell you to as long as it is safe.
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John, IMO that is nuts, do it to code, including legitmate local codes and be done with it.
 
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