Residential Service

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Re: Residential Service

There could be a million possible reasons for their requirements and they don't even have to be rational. But they do have to be legal and I'd ask for the code references just to be sure the inspector isn't phsyco.
 
Re: Residential Service

Originally posted by william runkle:
Please give an answer why would they require a 17 KW generator?
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That can only be answered by the authority the specified that a 17kw genset be used. There's no guidelines for this in the code.
 
Re: Residential Service

Perhaps the inspector did a load calculation for all the unnecessary added outlets he is requiring. 17kw comes out to 70.8 amps at 240 volts.

On a side note, and I'm not saying this is the case, but I have heard of a couple of instances where inspectors "required" something because there friend at the local store was selling it and he wanted to help the sales, get a kick back, etc.
 
Re: Residential Service

If I am reading this right, it is a 700 SF cabin in the woods?

If so, there may be some state or local code that requires electrical service brought to the building, but I would look into that. Also I am not too sure where the 17KW unit size is coming from.

I would be asking a lot of questions ;)
 
Re: Residential Service

Here in Indiana we have no state code that requires electric to be brought to a dwelling. A county in the north east Indiana tried to enforce this once on an Amish built house but lost to the state. Plumbing is not even required as there many cabins that are built back in the woods with nothing but four walls.
I do think if the house is in a sub-division the home owners association or covenant can require that the house must meet certain requirements, but not the local AHJ's as they have to follow state laws.

I can't see how an AHJ could make you supply a generator and tell you the size you have to buy? If an electric supply is not available how can they make you have to have power? I think a code like this could be shot down in court by the Constitution. Nobody should be able to tell us how we must live and how our house is supplied if its not affecting others. If the house gets sold well it should be up to the buyers to install electric if they want. Cars are sold all the time without engines?

I hate dictatorship!!! :mad:
 
Re: Residential Service

There there Wayne. :D

I'm glad I'm not the only guy who gets worked up over pushy unrestrained government.

I'm thinking these aren't actual legal requirements but rather some kind of inspector BS.

Edit: Error A

[ June 02, 2005, 02:55 AM: Message edited by: physis ]
 
Re: Residential Service

Wayne I agree to require a home to a
have power when none is available is like having to buy a vehicle in Hawai to have heater,hense no power no spacing rules,S.A. circuits etc.The NEC requires these items whem power is there,I guess it is the local ahj to make that call ;)
 
Re: Residential Service

THANKS TO ALL FOR THE REPLYS TO THIS QUESTION.

MY APPROACH WILL BE TO HAVE THE 200AMP SERVICE PANEL WITH PROVISIONS FOR THE FUTURE (ALL ELECTRIC), METER BASE AND SERVICE MAST. SOME OVER KILL BUT THE OWNER IS AGREEABLE.

AND I WILL ARGUE WITH THE AHJ THAT THE GEN. AND THE SUB PANEL HAVE BEEN SIZED TO CARRY THE LOAD OF SPECIFIC CIRCUITS. THE GEN WILL NOT BE THE 17KW THE OWNER WAS TOLD BY THE AHJ TO INSTALL.
 
Re: Residential Service

It's in case the inspector has more demands. :D

Edit: Just kidding budbla.

[ June 02, 2005, 02:50 PM: Message edited by: physis ]
 
Re: Residential Service

Originally posted by budbla:
The owner plans to install the normal service equipment (for the future), manual transfer switch and a sub panel (to supply the generator loads).
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The inspector might be under the impression your going to transfer power to the whole 100 amp service. Are you positive he knows that the Gen. will only be feeding the circuits in the Sub-Panel?

Dave
 
Re: Residential Service

Someone please exsplain to me the hazard involved if i only have 5500 watt gen feeding my house in a huricane.Common since tells you to treat it like green acres and watch what you turn on.The gen. is self protected from overload so whats the problem ?
 
Re: Residential Service

Originally posted by jimwalker:
Someone please exsplain to me the hazard involved if i only have 5500 watt gen feeding my house in a huricane.Common since tells you to treat it like green acres and watch what you turn on.The gen. is self protected from overload so whats the problem ?
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I don't see any hazard. Just poor design. In my opinion, the generator should be sized according to the load it will be supplying . A demand load calculation should be used just like for utility power.

Theoritically you could have a 100 amp service on many of todays houses that have a 200 amp service, and if the owner uses "Common sense" like you say, (Constantly monitoring use of all the circuits, turning off & on breakers to regulate the load)they would be able to use lots of things without tripping the 100 amp main. Sure it would work, and there is no "hazard" but it's really poor designing.
</font>
  • <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not every person that uses a transfer switch & generator is an electrician with knowlege of how to regulate the loads properly.</font>
  • <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I don't consider knowlege of electrical theory to be "Common Sense" at all.</font>
  • <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The "limited" power from a generator needs to be regulated in a "user friendly" way for the "common" person.</font>
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif"> That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it!

:)
Dave
 
Re: Residential Service

Originally posted by davedottcom:


</font>
  • <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Not every person that uses a transfer switch & generator is an electrician with knowlege of how to regulate the loads properly.</font>
  • <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I don't consider knowlege of electrical theory to be "Common Sense" at all.</font>
  • <font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The "limited" power from a generator needs to be regulated in a "user friendly" way for the "common" person.</font>
<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">
That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it!

:)
Dave
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I'm with you, especially about the "common sense". If it was so common, how come more people don't have it?
 
Re: Residential Service

IMO this is an area where the NEC maintains common sense.

702.5 Capacity and Rating.
An optional standby system shall have adequate capacity and rating for the supply of all equipment intended to be operated at one time. Optional standby system equipment shall be suitable for the maximum available fault current at its terminals. The user of the optional standby system shall be permitted to select the load connected to the system.
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IMO it could not be more clear that the homeowner can try to run their entire house from a 5000 watt generator.

When it trips they will learn what to leave off. :D
 
Re: Residential Service

So, when you put in the sub for the transfer switch, put the fridge, main lighting, and peanut receptacle on and verify (by load calc) that it's not going to exceed 200 amps! :)
 
Re: Residential Service

I don't think every generator application needs to be a roof mounted diesel.
 
Re: Residential Service

Originally posted by iwire:
Would you rather the code required the optionally installed generator to run the whole house?
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NOOO! Don't even say that..."They" might hear you!

I just finished a rather lengthy reply only to lose it after getting bumped off line! :p

Dave
 
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