Romex use in Industrial building. Allowed/Not allowed?

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drun

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San Diego, CA
We have a situation where we found a "handyman" installed Romex in a conduit in a paint shop at a State facility.
I remember this as being a no-no, but neither I nor my crew can find it in the current code book.
Any ideas where to look?
Thanks
 
Dennis Alwon said:
NM cable is allowed in conduit but why would he do that???
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I've run into NM cable in conduit many times, I think you need to be a handyman to know why, but I think it has to do with that is only kind of wire they know of.

Sometimes you do find handyman that does run THHN/THWN, but all conductors are same color, don't want to have to buy multiple colors and have too much left over I guess.

Maybe I should take the THHN/THWN part back, sometimes it is all old THW they pulled out from somewhere else.
 
One of my all time (not so) favorites with handyman and raceways is 1/2 inch FMC connectors used on 3/4 EMT, both straight and 90 degree fittings. Followed by short radius plumbing elbows on PVC conduit - or plumbing PVC which ever the local store had on hand.
 
drun said:
We have a situation where we found a "handyman" installed Romex in a conduit in a paint shop at a State facility.
I remember this as being a no-no, but neither I nor my crew can find it in the current code book.
Any ideas where to look?
Thanks
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Often paint shops are classified areas....few "handymen" even know what a classified area is. What does the rest of the installation look like?
 
kwired said:
I've run into NM cable in conduit many times, I think you need to be a handyman to know why,
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Today I learned I am a handyman. :D

Let's see if I can help you understand.

  • It's code compliant.
  • It's easy
  • It makes a lot of sense when most of the run is open
 
This is a steel building. The circuit is 240v, all conduit,and the "handyman" used 2-20a slim twin breakers feeding an air conditioner. The shop is a dual use machine shop and paint equipment storage area. I don't think it's a hazardous location, but everything in the original build is emt or better, not residential wire. We were called because said handyman landed both feeders on the same pole using both sides of the twin breaker.
:dunce:
 
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NM/Romex in conduit is code compliant - I learn something new every day on this site. I always thought that it was a violation, but in the hierarchy of code violations a rather minor one...

Does anyone have the section for NEC 2014 that allows it? And of course the next questions, cause I've seen all of these:

What about flexible metal conduit? Liquidtite?

I may never have to buy another wire type again! :lol:
 
Clodbuster said:
NM/Romex in conduit is code compliant - I learn something new every day on this site. I always thought that it was a violation, but in the hierarchy of code violations a rather minor one...

Does anyone have the section for NEC 2014 that allows it? And of course the next questions, cause I've seen all of these:

What about flexible metal conduit? Liquidtite?

I may never have to buy another wire type again! :lol:
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you can pull any cable through a raceway for the most part, but fill calculations would be based on the size of cable and if you look at chapter 9 table 1 if you pulled a single cable into the raceway the fill can be 53%. If we pulled three single conductors instead of 12-2 NM fill is only 40% but three 12 AWG conductors do take up less area then a 12-2 NM also - so take all that into consideration when determining how wise it is to pull exclusively NM through raceways. Occasional raceway for added protection to a NM cable may be desirable at times, especially for those that seldom run anything but NM cable. For those that typically stock and use THHN/THWN, pulling NM through raceway is usually pointless and cost more then running the THHN/THWN.
 
iwire said:
Today I learned I am a handyman. :D

Let's see if I can help you understand.

  • It's code compliant.
  • It's easy
  • It makes a lot of sense when most of the run is open
Click to expand...


I didn't take from the op that it was a sleeve. But I agree it is easy especially if all you have to do is sleeve it. The only reason to run nm in a complete raceway is because one doesn't have individual conductors
 
drun said:
This is a steel building. The circuit is 240v, all conduit,and the "handyman" used 2-20a slim twin breakers feeding an air conditioner. The shop is a dual use machine shop and paint equipment storage area. I don't think it's a hazardous location, but everything in the original build is emt or better, not residential wire. We were called because said handyman landed both feeders on the same pole using both sides of the twin breaker.
:dunce:
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There is nothing in Article 344 that restricts NM to residential occupancies.
 
Here in San Diego's local municipalities, it's always been a no-no. We are allowed to run it in PVC conduit when going between a residence and an out-building though.
Wouldn't you have to de-rate the ampacity due to less cooling efficiency of Romex in EMT conduit?
This was just one thing I didn't like about the installation. The guy installed slim-twins and landed 2 wires under some lugs, and couldn't figure out that because both sides of a twin brkr. are the same phase/pole the 220v air conditioner wouldn't run!
He also made wire nut splices in the panel because he cut the Romex too short. (Real professional).:lol:
 
drun said:
Here in San Diego's local municipalities, it's always been a no-no. We are allowed to run it in PVC conduit when going between a residence and an out-building though.
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Which is interesting since the code is pretty clear that the inside of an outdoor raceway is considered to be a wet area, where NM is not allowed.
 
electrofelon said:
so you frequently run NM through a complete raceway system? If that is the case, could you elaborate on why you find it advantageous over thhn?
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Have to run circuit from a panel to an outlet.

Run raceway out of the panel maybe 20' or 30' up and out of an electrical room into a suspended ceiling, NM or MC from there how ever far it is and then back into raceway to come down out of the ceiling with EMT into the outlet.

I find it very odd so many seem baffled by a common practice at least in my area.
 
not uncommon around here either. Heck, supply houses have romex to emt fitting.

Really not all that different then running UF through pvc
 
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