Sisal Rope

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don_resqcapt19 said:
The roping is specified in the manufacturer's instructions and it is UL's position (one that I don't agree with and have taken issue with many times) that any instructions provided by the manufacturer are 110.3(B) instructions and must be followed. As I recall the provided instructions specify the type of rope to be used. In this case the instructions specified sisal.
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Sounds like UL's position is over-reaching.

My point though was that I questioned that UL tested the SC withstand performance of the roping arrangement, therefore it was not part of their approval testing.

If UL have not tested the roping arrangement and should it result in a legal case, in your opinion, what percentages of liability would be assigned to the parties? UL/NEC/Square D?
 
don_resqcapt19 said:
"Roping" instructions, from the equipment manufacturer, are common with MCCs and switchgear.
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I have installed dozens of switchgear and 4-6 times as many MCC's in the past 35 and NEVER seen roping in ANY instruction books.

I have seen the practice though, but as I said above never in industrial switchgears or MCC's installed.
 
I think you're nuts. We can squeeze those same conductors in a metal pipe, often flooded with water if underground, but you have an objection to wrapping them with a rope. Does not compute. It's not like we're wrapping the rope around the conductor material. It's wrapped around the insulation of the conductors.
 
Let's keep on the topic. Weressl, Marc brings up a valid point. Do you have a scientific response?
 
weressl said:
Yes, he is an idiot.

That is my scientific response to him calling me nuts.

I have explained my concerns within the thread sufficently I have nothing more to add.
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Yes, you have really made yourself clear, you know more then the manufacturers of the equipment. :rolleyes:
 
iwire said:
Yes, you have really made yourself clear, you know more then the manufacturers of the equipment. :rolleyes:
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Yes and more than you because I LIVE with the equipment, not just design it and install it. So I do have long term continous experience with the equipment that neither you, nor the manufacturer could claim. Both you and the manufacturer show up AFTER the damage occured and were not the wittness to how these develop. :cool:

But hey, y'all welcome to ignore it, it ain't no skin off my back.:smile:
 
iwire said:
Well specifying is not installing. :)
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Let me see, I design it, draft it, specify it, order it, inspect in the factory, supervise the installation, commission it, operate it, rack it, troubleshoot it, maintain it, test it, analyze the failure modes, asked by manufacturer to be on the advisory panel in developing new gear.

I guess you right, I do not drive the forktruck that lifts it, I do not pull - currently - the wires to it.

You decide.


iwire said:
Pages 5, 6 & 7 of this Square D bulletin are kind of interesting.

P-frame and NS630b?NS1600 Circuit Breakers
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Please refer back to the comments I made on the previously posted questions. Again, questioned and answered. Should you have any comments on those questions please posted there. These pictures are dealing with the same issues with the same manufacturer as before. These breakers are switchboard or best MCC breakers. I have claimed no expereince with switchboards, rather switchgear and MCC's. I have NEVER seen this bracing in an MCC.
 
weressl said:
Yes, he is an idiot.
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:grin: Be that as it may...

How is wrapping the conductors with rope functionally worse than pulling those same conductors in a flooded metallic conduit? That's the question you've failed to provide a clear answer on. You have to break it down for the small minds like me.
 
weressl said:
You decide.
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I think it was fairly obvious I had.

BTW, you miss out, driving the folk lift is fun.:cool:


I have NEVER seen this bracing in an MCC.
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How does your lack of experience prove roping, as recommended by some manufacturers, is likely to cause a problem?

Personally I can only remember one piece of Square D switch gear that showed roping the conductors and it was not done.

Marc has asked you a direct question, one that I am very interested in seeing a direct answer to. :cool:
 
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iwire said:
I think it was fairly obvious I had.

BTW, you miss out, driving the folk lift is fun.:cool:
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The Bob Seeger kinda folk, or did you mean Mitshubishi. :D I did not say I never did, just not on these occasions. Union guys frown on it.


iwire said:
How does your lack of experience prove roping, as recommended by some manufacturers, is likely to cause a problem?
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I have seen resultant short circuits and fires.

iwire said:
Personally I can only remember one piece of Square D switch gear that showed roping the conductors and it was not done.

Marc has asked you a direct question, one that I am very interested in seeing a direct answer to. :cool:
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Asked and answered, find it.
 
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