Six throws maybe more

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goldstar said:
I was curious to know why I was seeing some of the responses I saw so I just went back and re-read the OP. It looks like I need to go back to school and take some reading lessons. The Op stated the following :If it's a main lug panelboard wouldn't there be a feeder disconnect for that panelboard at the main breaker panel ? In that case I don't see how or why the six switch rule would even apply.

I'll take that recipe for crow now.:p
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A disconnect at another building would not satisfy code at a separate structure. The disconnect must be at the separate structure, IMO.

225.32 Location. The disconnecting means shall be installed
either inside or outside of the building or structure
served or where the conductors pass through the building or
structure. The disconnecting means shall be at a readily
accessible location nearest the point of entrance of the conductors.
For the purposes of this section, the requirements
in 230.6 shall be utilized.
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Dennis Alwon said:
A disconnect at another building would not satisfy code at a separate structure. The disconnect must be at the separate structure, IMO.
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Agreed, but there is still over-current protection at the front end of the feeder. Would the six switch rule even apply in either case ?
 
goldstar said:
I was curious to know why I was seeing some of the responses I saw so I just went back and re-read the OP. It looks like I need to go back to school and take some reading lessons. The Op stated the following :If it's a main lug panelboard wouldn't there be a feeder disconnect for that panelboard at the main breaker panel ? In that case I don't see how or why the six switch rule would even apply.

I'll take that recipe for crow now.:p
Click to expand...

I guess the thread took off with the discussion of SERVICE panleboards as the OP stated the intention of using the 6 throw rule and that only applies to service panelboards*.
You are correct that the whole story changes once you have a main ahead of the panel and it becomes a "sub-panel" or "feeder panel" (note it would no longer be a 'service panel'.
408.36 requires a feeder panel be protected by a main (there is an exception for the servcie 6 disconenct rule)either internal or external.

*As noted in Dennis' post, there are rules for panel in separate structures and these have changed in the last 3 Code cycles so I will not muddy the water by going there,
 
There can be a main lug panel as a service disconnect with no main breaker if you follow the 6 disconnect rule and the panel is rated as a service equipment. As some have stated many MLO panels are suitable as service equipment if there is a main breaker kit installed.

If you have a panel that does not require the main breaker kit then you can use the 6 breaker rule either as a service disconnect or at the detached structure. I hope this helps
 
goldstar said:
Ok. I see all your points and I respect your opinions. However, why would you leave someone (usually a HO or a novice) the opportunity to easily create a Code violation? We all know what HO's are like. They think if there's spare breaker spaces, then whomever installed the panel originally must have figured on leaving me the ability to add more circuits. So, while it may not officially be a Code violation I still think it's wrong. Just my opinion (which probably counts for beans):cool:
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goldstar said:
I was curious to know why I was seeing some of the responses I saw so I just went back and re-read the OP. It looks like I need to go back to school and take some reading lessons. The Op stated the following :If it's a main lug panelboard wouldn't there be a feeder disconnect for that panelboard at the main breaker panel ? In that case I don't see how or why the six switch rule would even apply.

I'll take that recipe for crow now.:p
Click to expand...
It may be bad design choice to use the six disconnect rule for a service panel at a dwelling, dwelling related structures or even other light commercial applications that utilize 120/240 200 amp or less single phase supply. (too many underqualified people seem to end up working on those). Though the six disconnect rule still applies for a separate building supplied by a feeder, at least there is an overcurrent device somewhere upstream when it is not service equipment.

Otherwise I have installed something like - 800 amp bus I-Line panel with main lugs, with up to six permitted service disconnecting means in the panel. There was still space for more breakers to be installed - but you average handyman or maintenance man is not going to play in an I-line panelboard - they think it is too complicated for them. The ones that will play in there - would find a way to mess things up even if it couldn't take more breakers. This is a different ball game then the 12 space MLO Homeline panel in an outbuilding with limited loads and only a 60 amp feeder to the building, that is just inviting someone not qualified to just snap in a breaker for another circuit. For one thing unless they are adding a 125+amp breaker to the I-line panel it often is not a good place to add the breaker - and if a non qualified decides to check into adding a I-line breaker (even just a single pole 20 amp) the price will change their minds in a hurry, or encourage even worse methods of adding what they want:roll:
 
Lets beef this up -- load calc @ less than 200 amps -- suitable panel for service is a main lug 12 circuit panel -- service is fed into the lugs -- conductors are ated @ 200 amps -- put 6 - 200A 2 pole breakers for feeders to 42 circuit panels -- talk about possible addtion of loads
 
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