Speed wire Receptacles

[erdy7821]

I have an AHJ that says you cannot use the screws on a receptacle if you use the speed wire connections on the back. I cannot find anything in the code book to back this up. Any input would be helpful.

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

The following quote is from the UL guide for Receptacles for Attachment Plugs and Plugs.

Single and duplex receptacles rated 15 and 20 A that are provided with more than one set of terminals for the connection of line and neutral conductors have been investigated to feed branch circuit conductors connected to other outlets on a multi-outlet branch circuit, as follows:

Back wire (screw actuated clamp type) terminations with multiple wire access holes used concurrently to terminate more than one conductor
Side wire (binding screw) terminals used concurrently with their respective push-in (screwless) terminations to terminate more than one conductor

Single and duplex receptacles rated 15 and 20 A that are provided with more than one set of terminals for the connection of line and neutral conductors have not been investigated to feed branch circuit conductors connected to other outlets on a multi-outlet branch circuit, as follows:

Side wire (binding screw) terminal with its associated back wire (screw actuated clamp type) terminal
Multiple conductors under a single binding screw
Multiple conductors in a single back wire hole

Are you using the side screws with the "push-in" connections? If so that is in compliance with the UL listing, but it is something that I would never do. If you are using the back "screw actuated clamp terminals and putting additional wires under the side screw, you are not in compliance with the listing information.
Don

[ January 08, 2004, 04:12 PM: Message edited by: don_resqcapt19 ]

 

[a.wayne3@verizon.net]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

erdy2871,are you saying that an inspector has cited a job because the receptacles will be hooked and stabbed ???

 

[bigjohn67]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

"stabbing outlets" is a guaranteed service call at a later date.
Avoid the trouble and pigtail the wires.

 

[binney]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Are you using the side screws with the "push-in" connections? If so that is in compliance with the UL listing, but it is something that I would never do.

"stabbing outlets" is a guaranteed service call at a later date.

I used to believe the same thing, but where I work now we back stab. The time it saves is unbelievable and it will more than pay for itself on the rare occasion we need to replace one. If you strip the wires properly and check to make sure the stab grabs you have very few that fail.

 

[jimwalker]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Is back stapping a good idea with afci causing so much trouble ?

 

[don_resqcapt19]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

binney,
I have never seen what I would consider to be a "quality" receptacle that had back stab terminations and will not use them. If they are so good why did UL change the listing so they can't be used on 20 amp branch circuits?
Don

 

[luke warmwater]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Don,
I have to agree with you. As from the time I started in this trade, I was taught not to 'backstab'. And My company policy holds true to this teaching.
Have you read or heard of any proposals to eventually stop this practice on #14ga. also??
Some are 'stabbers'
And Some are 'stabbing wrappers'

 

[speedypetey]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Binney,

Your company back stabs receptacles and does not use multi-wire home runs? Sounds like a place I want to work.

[ January 08, 2004, 10:10 PM: Message edited by: speedypetey ]

 

[tim]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

We don't buy any 14 gage wire. 12 is the only way to go. I use to back stab all the time. Since you can't stab 12 anymore, we have gotten use to wrapping. Don't shove it into me when you can wrap me and be snug. (OUCH) Tim

 

[goldstar]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

I've always been an opponent of back-stabbing (no pun intended). The stab feature is Ok if you pigtail your circuits and then stab that single device. But, at that point, why would you stab ? You've already lost time cutting, stripping and splicing the wires. How much more time can you save by stabbing ?

The service calls really start to occur when you cascade receptacles (i.e in the back of the first out the back to the second, etc.). If you have, say 8 receptacles on the circuit, and your customer begins to plug in appliances, the stab clips in the first receptacle are taking the load for everything plugged in down stream of it. Eventually it will heat up, expand and either start arcing or, if your customer is lucky, open up completely. These are great service calls for me. Cha ching !!!!! For those of you who use stabs exclusively in my area.......keep up the good work :roll: . I'll take all the service calls I can get

 

[electricman2]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Quote by Luke Warmwater

Some are 'stabbers'
Some are 'wrappers'

I guess I am a "wrapper". I have wasted too much time chasing down lost nuetrals because of back stabbed connections.

 

[tonyi]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

When I ease back stabbed devices out of a box, I'd say about 50% of them have one or more wires just fall right out...

Debugging a problem in my lawyer's daughter's bedroom (a place built in 1999), the percentage went up to 100%. The stuff went back in the wall pigtailed and looped

 

[jimwalker]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

While back stabbing is still legal ,let me ask,would you want this in a house built for you to live in next 50 years.Mine are wraped.
Do i stabb others ? yes if my boss wants to save that few seconds.We do not call the shots if we work for others.

 

[binney]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

I'll lay money I can strip, loop and terminate within 10 seconds of your quick wire method.
OK, that's 500 seconds in a house with 50 devices. A whopping 8 minutes

I'll take that bet!

But that's not where you save the time, it's at the rough. How long does it take you to tail down the reds, tail down the blacks, tail down the nuetral . While your doing this I'm 20 boxes ahead with my greenies. Away I GO! After I'm done roughing, I'll go do a plug a switch and be done with that before your done roughing.


Remember this is all in good fun!

 

[jimwalker]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Binnie what if i use a small screw gun?
and if i was carefull all i have is 14-2 in 14-2 out so no pig tails.I can install with cover,a duplex using screws in 1 minute.Yes you will beat me but my how much ? Average house maybe 60 items,you win by what ,half hour ? Will it be worth it if 1 wire comes lose ?
And glad to see your still with us.

[ January 09, 2004, 07:44 PM: Message edited by: jimwalker ]

 

[luke warmwater]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Originally posted by jimwalker:
And glad to see your still with us.

Jim, just F.Y.I. BINNEY is not BENNY.

 

[jimwalker]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

ooops

 

[racraft]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Originally posted by tim:
We don't buy any 14 gage wire. 12 is the only way to go. I use to back stab all the time. Since you can't stab 12 anymore, we have gotten use to wrapping. Don't shove it into me when you can wrap me and be snug. (OUCH) Tim

What do you do when adding to or reparing an existing circuit that is wired with 14 gauge wire? Do you mix 12 and 14 on the same circuit? This is clearly inappropriate and I wouldn't let you do get away with it in my house.

 

[tonyi]

Re: Speed wire Receptacles

Mixing 14 12 or even 10/8 is perfectly OK as long as the OCPD covers the smallest wire in the branch. There can be voltage drop and derating situations where doing so is required.

ex. some 15A branch is added to to feed some outdoor lighting down a 1/4 mile long driveway. There could easily be cause to mix 14 and 8 in a situation like that.