- Location
- Illinois
- Occupation
- retired electrician
It is not a code violation, it is more secure than many of the commercially available supports, and it can be installed in a neat and workman like manner.
Strapping EMT conduit.
- Thread starter Petewales
- Start date
- Status
Well if a inspector cited it he would be making up his own rules.
BTW, Neat and workman like manner is in the eye of the beholder and not enforcible.
Roger
Petewales
Member
- Location
- Hayward, California.
Tie Wire As E.M.T. Support.
Tie Wire As E.M.T. Support.
Thanks guys...very informative.
Tie Wire As E.M.T. Support.
Thanks guys...very informative.
San -Brooke
Member
- Location
- USA
The way I see it based on what the white book says on page 112 you must refer to UL 2239 "Hardware for the Support of Conduit, Tubing, and Cable"
1 Scope
1.1 These requirements cover hardware for the support of conduit, tubing, and cable, such as HANGERS, STAPLES, STRAPS, and similar devices for installation in accordance with the National Electrical Code, NFPA 70, and the Canadian Electrical Code (CEC), Part I.
1.2 These requirements also cover STANDOFFS for nonmetallic-sheathed cable and PROTECTOR PLATES.
1.3 These requirements do not cover hardware for use with surface raceway, wireway, or busway systems, sprinkler systems, and other piping systems used for fire protection service, hardware for use with lighting fixtures, or hardware for grounding and bonding applications.
1.4 These requirements do not cover:
a) Hardware intended to support boxes (see UL 514A or CSA C22.2 No. 18.1),
b) Conduit and cable fittings (see UL 514B or CSA C22.2 No. 18.3),
c) Reducing washers (see UL 514B or CSA C22.2 No. 18.3),
d) Pulling grips for cable or cord (see UL 514B or CSA C22.2 No. 18.3),
e) Cable ties (see UL 1565 or CSA C22.2 No. 18.5), or
f) Positioning devices (see UL 1565 or CSA C22.2 No. 18.5).
It also states in the white book on page 112 that the UL listing for the product is only required on the smallest unit container the product is packaged in therefore just because a strap may not have a UL listing on it does not neceassarily mean it is not listed. However tie wire is not listed in the white book which IMHO then would violate NEC 110.3 (B). And then clearly cannot legitimately be used as a means of support.
b) Conduit and cable fittings (see UL 514B or CSA C22.2 No. 18.3),
c) Reducing washers (see UL 514B or CSA C22.2 No. 18.3),
d) Pulling grips for cable or cord (see UL 514B or CSA C22.2 No. 18.3),
e) Cable ties (see UL 1565 or CSA C22.2 No. 18.5), or
f) Positioning devices (see UL 1565 or CSA C22.2 No. 18.5).
It also states in the white book on page 112 that the UL listing for the product is only required on the smallest unit container the product is packaged in therefore just because a strap may not have a UL listing on it does not neceassarily mean it is not listed. However tie wire is not listed in the white book which IMHO then would violate NEC 110.3 (B). And then clearly cannot legitimately be used as a means of support.
Thanks but, I know what the White Book says and the way small items are identified, that was not what I asked. I ask to be shown a one hole EMT strap that is listed for the purpose and yes, it will be on the packaging.
Now let's look at 110.3(B), if an item is not listed 110.3(B) can not be cited as a violation.
Roger
San -Brooke
Member
- Location
- USA
Nope, that won't do it, those are for RMC and IMC, not EMT.
I will have to look tomorrow and see if those file numbers are in fact for securing or just positioning devices.
This where a lot of confusion comes to play, just because there is a mention of UL or any NRTL it doesn't mean it is listed for everything across the board.
Roger
San -Brooke
Member
- Location
- USA
Yes I just edited my link sorry for that, now it has the EMT straps.
kwired
Electron manager
- Location
- NE Nebraska
- Occupation
- EC
It also doesn't mean you have to use a listed product just because there is one for the application. I don't believe the NEC requires listing of most raceway supporting devices. Which raises the question - why are some listed in the first place? If you use one that is listed, you now have to follow its instructions
I guess the key here may be whether or not a strap or clamp is considered to be a "fitting". If it is then the part xxx.6 section of most raceway articles will require fittings to be listed.
Last edited:
Okay, you edited your link while I was posting. The link specifically says for supporting but does not say securing and as in Caddy products, the listing seems to be covering positioning devices.
I am just asking to see a listing that specifically list a one hole strap for securing.
Roger
I am just asking to see a listing that specifically list a one hole strap for securing.
Roger
San -Brooke
Member
- Location
- USA
POSITIONING DEVICES (ZODZ)
Positioning DevicesZODZGENERAL
This category covers cable ties, cable tie mounts, and similar types of related hardware for field installation in accordance with ANSI/NFPA 70, "National Electrical Code." The investigation of these products includes consideration of the rated mechanical strength, maximum operating temperature, smoke and heat generation, corrosion resistance and weatherability characteristics as appropriate for the product.
And that is fine but does not show me a listing "for the purpose of securing tubing".
With that said, if cable ties are going to be used wouldn't you agree that tie wire would be a much better method of securing EMT. I know I can snatch or yank on must things secured with common size wire ties and break them, I can not do that with tie wire.
Roger
- Status