Suspended Ceiling Support

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PrimaryElectric

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Today a Dade County inspector told me I must support the ceiling grid within 12" from all four corners of all my 2x4 layin fixtures. I told him that if I have my electricians support the ceiling grid it will look like hammered dog sh*t. He just gave me a stupid look. I asked him what code article required electricians to support ceiling grid and he said he didnt know and that his supervisor told him this. Seems to be a new trend for response at the Dade County building department. I said he will check with his supervisor and let me know. Any Ideas what the supervisor will say on this one?
 
PrimaryElectric said:
. Any Ideas what the supervisor will say on this one?
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I have no idea what the supervisor will say. Maybe this is a local code. After reading your other thread, maybe the inspector doesn't like you. (just kidding). Maybe the inspector is shooting from the hip. Hard to say what goes through some people's minds. Good luck.
 
Tell the GC that the supervising electrical inspector :roll: says the Ceiling contractor hasn't installed the ceiling correctly, then let them fight it out.

I have seen specs that do call for this in the Acoustical Ceiling Installation section.

Roger
 
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I am not sure what seismic zone you are in. But in my area we have to install suspended ceiling grid systems in accordance with the CISCA (ceiling & interior systems construction association) "Guidelines for seismic restraint direct hung suspended ceiling assemblies" manual for seismic zones 3 & 4.

In this manual there is a section that states " When intermediate-duty systems are used, No. 12 guage hanger wires shall be attached to the grid members within 3 inches of each corner of each fixture."

The inspector might be using a similar guide and that is where this requirement is comming from. I don't know why it would be the electrical contractors responsibility to install the hanger wires though?

Just a though.

Chris
 
raider1 said:
I don't know why it would be the electrical contractors responsibility to install the hanger wires though?

Just a thought.

Chris
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I agree. Let the ceiling contractor and the GC worry about it. That is unless of course your contract requires you to install the ceiling grid.:rolleyes:
 
Maybe its a FL thing but we are forced by fire marshal to do opasit corners on own grid wire,some let us go with screws to main beam.You can not win this one ,just give fire marshal what he /she wants
 
Jim W in Tampa said:
Maybe its a FL thing but we are forced by fire marshal to do opasit corners on own grid wire,some let us go with screws to main beam.You can not win this one ,just give fire marshal what he /she wants
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nec 410.16 (c) Securely fastened to the ceiling frameing member. We require 4 corners. Electrician installs his own wires for MC Cable supports. Hanging fixtures to the roof not required.
 
We have to support lay-ins with grid wire from opposite corners to the structural ceiling. I think its a fire marshal thing. The ceiling has to be able to be torn down without any fixtures, wires, etc. dropping on top of a fire fighter.
 
JohnJ0906 said:
The ceiling has to be able to be torn down without any fixtures, wires, etc. dropping on top of a fire fighter.
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What fire fighter in their right mind would tear down a ceiling grid? What method would a fire fighter use to tear down a ceiling grid? What possible reason could there be to tear a ceiling grid down during a fire? If a ceiling grid is designed to not come down during an earthquake, what chance does a fire fighter have against a properly supported suspended ceiling system?
 
iwire said:
Most all?

some of the grid may drop as well.
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Is this why I must support the ceiling grid? Was there a study done that shows the amount of grid that will come down when a fire fighter uses the standard fire fighter procedure for ceiling tile removal.
 
We don't support the GRID, we support fixtures, equipment, and wire seperate from the grid. I have no idea why the electrician should support the grid.
 
JohnJ0906 said:
We don't support the GRID, we support fixtures, equipment, and wire seperate from the grid. I have no idea why the electrician should support the grid.
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You obviously live in a part of the country ruled by common sense and dignity. We here in south Florida are a whole different breed. So many electrical contractors down here support the ceiling grid just to appease the electrical inspectors ridiculous request, it has become the norm. Its so normal now that general contractors think the electrician should be supporting the ceiling grid. If it gets any worse I will have to have my electricians trained in ceiling grid installation. Is it illegal for me as a licensed contractor to install ceiling grid? I mean can I be charged for working with out a GC license? Because I dont have one so maybe the trend is that in order to do electrical work in suspended ceiling systems you must be a licensed GC and EC.
 
What method would a fire fighter use to tear down a ceiling grid?
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I do not believe they strive to tear down the grid, just vent the problem. That is not the only time a ceiling can and will fall, the fixtures are heavy and should stay up. I myself have never heard what the inspector was asking, I have however heard of supporting a fixture with grid wire.
 
If it gets any worse I will have to have my electricians trained in ceiling grid installation.
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I think we all would agree that an electrician wears more hats than most! That is what makes us unique and interesting.:smile: I happen to like the fact that our talents are so diverse, from cutting and pouring concrete to penetrating and sealing roofs. Whatever it takes to get the job done and get paid.
 
barbeer said:
I think we all would agree that an electrician wears more hats than most! That is what makes us unique and interesting.:smile: I happen to like the fact that our talents are so diverse, from cutting and pouring concrete to penetrating and sealing roofs. Whatever it takes to get the job done and get paid.
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I don't want to take work away from concrete and roofing contractors, thats how they feed their kids. My ability to mix a bag of concrete or smear bull around a roof penetration doesn't qualify me to perform these tasks to code or specification. I'd say a roofer or concrete contractor licensed in their trade would be far more capable and proficient. Maybe we should give the interior framing contractor back his hat a insist he be smart enough to support the ceiling grid around light fixtures according to whatever code dictates. I certainly don't know which code that is and no one frequenting here has come forth.
 
I can't believe you guys in South FL put up with this. Aren't there any specs on these jobs? Aren't the Ceiling contractors required to install these ceilings per code and manufacturers instructions?

Do the Building inspectors know there is a proper way the ceiling has to be installed and that this may mean extra support around fixtures, duct registers, exhaust fans, etc...,?

Some of our local building inspectors want to see the instructions before signing off on ceilings

I can't help but just shake my head in amazement when I hear of some of this stuff.

I have jobs going right now with somewhere between 1500 and 2000 fixtures, and with the expense involved I would not and could not entertain the thought of spending my material and labor to make another contractors installation compliant with their codes.

If the design calls for all bidding the project to provide slack wires to the fixture itself that is another story, but we won't be tyeing up grid.

Roger
 
There is a requirement in SREF for 4 supports on suspended fixtures.

I'll try to find it for you.
I wonder if the inspector has confused yourcommercial building fora school.
 
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