The problem with metallic lamp bases and AFCI’s

[brantmacga]

I was installing lamps today in a chandelier in a house we’re working on. Like most it has those metallic sleeves that cover the lampholder.

They extend slightly above the plastic lampholder and make contact with the base of the lamp; so now we have a neutral-ground contact and it’s tripping the AFCI. You can work it just right where they don’t touch, but the slightest bump of the fixture rattles the sleeves and causes them to contact the lamp.

These same lamps used to come with a plastic coating over the base. Now they just leave it exposed. I asked the fixture supplier to find a different lamp or come cut these sleeves.

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[K8MHZ]

I was installing lamps today in a chandelier in a house we’re working on. Like most it has those metallic sleeves that cover the lampholder.

They extend slightly above the plastic lampholder and make contact with the base of the lamp; so now we have a neutral-ground contact and it’s tripping the AFCI. You can work it just right where they don’t touch, but the slightest bump of the fixture rattles the sleeves and causes them to contact the lamp.

These same lamps used to come with a plastic coating over the base. Now they just leave it exposed. I asked the fixture supplier to find a different lamp or come cut these sleeves.

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Just curious, are they listed?

 

[brantmacga]

Just curious, are they listed?

Have not looked at the box but I will tomorrow.


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[blkmagik21]

Also a bit of 88t around the base will solve that problem. Those are led so they prob won’t be relamping that fixture much if at all.


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[Gary11734]

Also a bit of 88t around the base will solve that problem. Those are led so they prob won’t be relamping that fixture much if at all.


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That is what I was thinking, Tape it! It's not like the old days where you have a lot of heat and could not put tape on it....

 

[LarryFine]

Or heat-shrink.

 

[RumRunner]

I had the same thing on my chandelier and the two porch wall mounted lamps. The sleeves were made out of high temp fish paper. . .similar to those used for rewinding xfmr and motors.

The old filament type bulbs made them brittle that they crumble.
So I cut short pieces of cpvc high temp tubing. They come in white so I painted them black.

High temperature CPVC are good up to 200 deg F. They come with red tracer to distinguish them from those for sprinklers.

Those new LEDs hardly put out any heat to be concerned about.

 

[GoldDigger]

I am pretty sure that any chandelier that exposed the metal of the lamp base that way, even if it relies on properly polarized wiring to make it the grounded conductor, will not pass any UL inspection, and I would consider that design clearly unsafe.
That said, you could also switch to a GE AFCI without the GF detection function.

 

[brantmacga]

The problem with metallic lamp bases and AFCI’s

That said, you could also switch to a GE AFCI without the GF detection function.

Not a GE fan. But I wish SqD would make their AFI’s without GF.


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[kwired]

I am pretty sure that any chandelier that exposed the metal of the lamp base that way, even if it relies on properly polarized wiring to make it the grounded conductor, will not pass any UL inspection, and I would consider that design clearly unsafe.
That said, you could also switch to a GE AFCI without the GF detection function.

Then you would be putting neutral current on the EGC which isn't right either

Not a GE fan. But I wish SqD would make their AFI’s without GF.


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Not an AFCI fan, wish they all would stop making them

I was installing similar lamps just a few days ago, they had a clear non metallic (maybe teflon or silicone) sleeve around where the base and glass meet. I wondered why they had that on there, but after seeing your situation, I think those particular lamps would prevent the trouble you are having - so maybe that is what they are for. Sorry don't remember who the manufacturer was.

 

[brantmacga]

The problem with metallic lamp bases and AFCI’s

Just curious, are they listed?

Not listed. Sending them back.

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[K8MHZ]

Not listed. Sending them back.

What about the lamp bases? That's what I meant. I don't think bulbs have to be listed but 410.6 requires luminaires to be listed.

 

[brantmacga]

What about the lamp bases? That's what I meant. I don't think bulbs have to be listed but 410.6 requires luminaires to be listed.

Oh, idk.... it’s a Kilcher brand fixture so I’d be confident they are.


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[K8MHZ]

Oh, idk.... it’s a Kilcher brand fixture so I’d be confident they are.


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I just snooped around Kichler's lighting site and found nothing about any sort of listing. I even downloaded spec sheets and instruction sheets.

 

[K8MHZ]

My suspicion that the fixture may not have been listed was based upon the fact that I don't think a fixture that would allow the lamp's screw shell to come into contact with the metal on the fixture would have passed listing requirements.

 

[mbrooke]

Those look like Euro bulbs, not sure, but in Europe its common for lamps to be like that.