To do or not to do...

[ptonsparky]

Take down 240 fixtures, install 240 LED. Time consuming and other projects would have to be worked in. Fixtures in the +500 to +900 range.

We have taken on larger dollar projects in the last few years but am not sure the headaches are worth it. You loose some smaller jobs to take care of the bigger.

 

[iwire]

In my opinion turning down work has long lasting side effects.

I am not a contractor but I think I would rather cater to the customers with large jobs than smaller ones.

Can you use temp help on this big job? We use temps often, the company recently did a 66,000+ panel solar field and it could not have happened without temps on that job and others.

 

[Fulthrotl]

Take down 240 fixtures, install 240 LED. Time consuming and other projects would have to be worked in. Fixtures in the +500 to +900 range.

We have taken on larger dollar projects in the last few years but am not sure the headaches are worth it. You loose some smaller jobs to take care of the bigger.

i'd guess it depends on the profit on the fixtures. is there enough money in this to warrant the trouble?
the good thing is that the reduction of power means there won't be any recircuiting, as the existing loads
would be higher than what you are replacing them with.

you haven't said what type of fixture change out this is....

 

[Cow]

A lighting retrofit is a good job for a gopher or two. They can pack new lights in and stage them where they need to be, unbox them. Then pack the old lights out. Also, with that many fixtures to throw out, I'd be looking at a rolloff box rental. If you're required to properly dispose of the lamps, they can box those up too.

 

[iwire]

Also, with that many fixtures to throw out, I'd be looking at a rolloff box rental.

As would we, we might even get separate dumpsters for steel, aluminum and trash. With the steel and aluminum going to the scrapyard. No sense paying to have stuff hauled out as trash when you can get even a little money for it and no hauling fees.

If you're required to properly dispose of the lamps, they can box those up too.

This is always the case for us and it may be $0.50 to $1.00 per lamp, don't forget to include it in the pricing.

 

[Dennis Alwon]

I am not a contractor but I think I would rather cater to the customers with large jobs than smaller ones.

Not always the best scenario in the resi market as many big builders either go under, don't pay or have no work during the down time. I have found having a good mix helps during the slow time but I would not put all my eggs in one basket. BTW, I will never be rich either- made a decent living but not like some of the commercial guys who do lots of large scale jobs. They usually hire and fire as the jobs come and go.

 

[iwire]

Not always the best scenario in the resi market as many big builders either go under, don't pay or have no work during the down time.

No doubt but I don't know that OP is in the 'resi market'

I have found having a good mix helps during the slow time but I would not put all my eggs in one basket.

I agree, and I don't think any electrical contractor of any size should put all there eggs in one basket.

Go back to my post and I think you can see I am not suggesting to only do big work. I suggested using temps to do both. Put his own employees on the small jobs and load the big job with a leader he trusts to run a boat load of temps. Obviously each area is different but around here there are places to hire temp workers with licenses or apprentices. I generally work alone now but if I do need a guy for a day or two often the office will send me a temp instead of pulling a guy off of another ongoing job.

 

[mgookin]

Take down 240 fixtures, install 240 LED. Time consuming and other projects would have to be worked in. Fixtures in the +500 to +900 range.

We have taken on larger dollar projects in the last few years but am not sure the headaches are worth it. You loose some smaller jobs to take care of the bigger.

If those are street lights you can blow them out pretty quick. If they're in offices you have to work around the employees and operations with greater uncertainties and liabilities.

 

[iwire]

If they're in offices you have to work around the employees and operations with greater uncertainties and liabilities.

For sure on that and that is why we do it at night most times. The much greater speed more than makes up for the added cost of night rate pay the guys get for switching to nights for the duration of the job.

 

[ptonsparky]

Dairy. Mostly unrestricted access. All 20' height. Cold in winter. Hot in summer. Flies. Mosquitos. Smell. Dirty. 30 miles from town. I hate to hire/fire, but temp help is a thought.

 

[petersonra]

The bottom line is the bottom line. If you can make money at it and not have it negatively impact other work, why not give it a shot.

I am always a little suspicious when our salesmen come in with something we have little or no experience at and think it is a great prospect. My first question is why are they not getting someone that already knows what they are doing.

This sounds like something that is not real far off from what you can do, even if it is a long way out and under unpleasant conditions.

 

[cdslotz]

I would be all over a job like this IF I furnished the fixtures.
The markup on the l lighting alone would be worth it.
Low labor risk...get in...get out

 

[kwired]

The bottom line is the bottom line. If you can make money at it and not have it negatively impact other work, why not give it a shot.

I am always a little suspicious when our salesmen come in with something we have little or no experience at and think it is a great prospect. My first question is why are they not getting someone that already knows what they are doing.

This sounds like something that is not real far off from what you can do, even if it is a long way out and under unpleasant conditions.

You don't travel much further north of OP's location and 30 miles is nothing to the people that live/work in that area, 30 miles may even be something the OP doesn't even consider to be very far. Unpleasant conditions? That is personal opinion. If you live and frequently work in agriculture - especially livestock operations - dairy is pretty clean, but still is horrible to those that never go to such places:happyyes:

I would be all over a job like this IF I furnished the fixtures.
The markup on the l lighting alone would be worth it.
Low labor risk...get in...get out

Again, livestock operations is not for everyone.

 

[Cow]

Dairy. Mostly unrestricted access. All 20' height. Cold in winter. Hot in summer. Flies. Mosquitos. Smell. Dirty. 30 miles from town. I hate to hire/fire, but temp help is a thought.

Again, livestock operations is not for everyone.

I agree Kwired. We do work for several large dairies about 45 mins from town, I wouldn't even think twice about doing a lighting retrofit. It all boils down to what you are used too, I guess?

Throw some extra money in there for drive time and washing off your equipment with a hose if you need too. We've used a temp agency for laborers before, but usually what shows up isn't worth what you're paying them. You might be better off hiring a relative or young person you know who wants to make some extra money, at least then you'll know what you're getting.

 

[kwired]

I agree Kwired. We do work for several large dairies about 45 mins from town, I wouldn't even think twice about doing a lighting retrofit. It all boils down to what you are used too, I guess?

Throw some extra money in there for drive time and washing off your equipment with a hose if you need too. We've used a temp agency for laborers before, but usually what shows up isn't worth what you're paying them. You might be better off hiring a relative or young person you know who wants to make some extra money, at least then you'll know what you're getting.

The ruralness (if there is such a word) of where I live kind of dictates that anything within about 60 miles is a job worth consideration. Now someone that wants me to come out and fix something simple better be prepared for some extra time, mileage, or whatever or at least be willing to wait until I have some other project close enough that it doesn't cost me much to slip over to do their little task.

 

[kwired]

Dairy. Mostly unrestricted access. All 20' height. Cold in winter. Hot in summer. Flies. Mosquitos. Smell. Dirty. 30 miles from town. I hate to hire/fire, but temp help is a thought.

My personal preference on this one would be to do it no sooner then October. Maybe even a little later then that depending on what kind of weather we get, but sometimes you don't get what you want either. That time of year most of the flies and other insects are gone or at least only seen mid day when temps do come up enough that they become active. And I would rather work in cold then heat.

 

[J.P.]

Sounds like a easy job ( knock on wood ) to me. 30 miles is considered close in my area as well. Takes longer to drive across town sometimes than drive 30 miles on the highway.

I have no idea how many guys you have though. My co would take a job like that and be glad to keep a couple of guys busy for a bit.

 

[Fulthrotl]

Dairy. Mostly unrestricted access. All 20' height. Cold in winter. Hot in summer. Flies. Mosquitos. Smell. Dirty. 30 miles from town. I hate to hire/fire, but temp help is a thought.

concrete dairy floor, i'm assuming? little electric zoom boom, just change out one at a time?
and if you can schedule it for the "reduced flies and vermin" season, and remember to breathe
thru your ears, what could go wrong...?
:roll:

and what CD said, about furnishing the fixtures, and markup on that, is what makes it worth
doing. if they want to buy fixtures off the net, and just have you provide labor.... welll.....
i'm doing my hair that week..... i'd really like to, but.....

it could be worse... you could be setting the floats on the bar screen room... don't ask.

 

[kwired]

concrete dairy floor, i'm assuming? little electric zoom boom, just change out one at a time?
and if you can schedule it for the "reduced flies and vermin" season, and remember to breathe
thru your ears, what could go wrong...?
:roll:

and what CD said, about furnishing the fixtures, and markup on that, is what makes it worth
doing. if they want to buy fixtures off the net, and just have you provide labor.... welll.....
i'm doing my hair that week..... i'd really like to, but.....

it could be worse... you could be setting the floats on the bar screen room... don't ask.

Typically areas that get washed regularly are concrete floors. They are also sloped because they are washed with reuse water pumped from the wastewater lagoon, 3 or 4 times a day they have large tanks that dump large volume of water from top end to flush all the manure that has accumulated since last flush.

Depend on what kind of use the area is there are different obstacles. Since he mentioned the high ceilings most of what he would be working on is likely the "free stall" area where cows spend most of their time. There are typically concrete alleyways in this area. The cows usually have some "stalls" with dirt (usually fresh sand that is replaced as needed) floor where they will lay down, comfortable cows are better producers. Those are fairly permanent and one would need more then just a scissor lift if anything is above them to reach it. Areas where other work is done may have many gates/gate panels that may not be as easy to work over either unless using a lift with an extension boom.

Plus the place is full of cows. Holsteins - one of the most popular breeds used for dairy production seem to be curious about everything. You don't leave things laying around or they are going to mess with it. Even if you are on a man lift an not in direct contact with them - they will chew on wiring, hoses or anything exposed on the lift, open machine access doors if not secured, may even mess with any exposed ground controls and give you a ride you were not expecting. It is something they are not used to seeing everyday and they are going to check it out, that is their nature. If they do gain access to something but don't damage it - it will likely be slobbered all over at the very least.

 

[Cow]

Kwired's got it. Cows will get into everything on the lift.

I've tried running solo on a boom lift working in the pens but the cows kept pushing the e-stop on me in the air, probably about 3-4 times one day. Fortunately, I was in the milking parlor holding pen and could yell to the closest employee. After the first time it got pushed he knew what I needed so I only had to motion to him after that.:rant:

Now when I do it, I figure on a ground man to move cows out of the way, open gates for me, and keep cows from chewing on my material when I come down.

Don't forget to keep an eye on the keys either or they'll be gone too!