Type of box

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jcole

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Lawrenceburg, Kentucky
What do you guys do when you install a box for a chandelier expecting to mount with a strap and instead it mounts with stud and hickey? I am not use to mounting large chand. but this one was a lot bigger than I assumed. I normally install metal pan boxes for chand. but they all mount with a strap. I understand that the stud is used to support the chand. by the building structure instead of the box. Is there a special type box that can have a strap or stud/hickey mount. What type of box/setup should I use if I know during rough in that the box will mount with stud/hickey? Lack of experience is costing me. Any help will be appreciated.
 
jcole said:
What do you guys do when you install a box for a chandelier expecting to mount with a strap and instead it mounts with stud and hickey? I am not use to mounting large chand. but this one was a lot bigger than I assumed. I normally install metal pan boxes for chand. but they all mount with a strap. I understand that the stud is used to support the chand. by the building structure instead of the box. Is there a special type box that can have a strap or stud/hickey mount. What type of box/setup should I use if I know during rough in that the box will mount with stud/hickey? Lack of experience is costing me. Any help will be appreciated.
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I install the hickey (edit) crow's foot with nuts and bolts right through a metal box that is mounted to a 2x4 or 2x6.
 
Dennis Alwon said:
I install the hickey (edit) crow's foot with nuts and bolts right through a metal box that is mounted to a 2x4 or 2x6.
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Here's a picture of a crow's foot
slang93.jpg
 
Box

Box

jcole said:
What do you guys do when you install a box for a chandelier expecting to mount with a strap and instead it mounts with stud and hickey? I am not use to mounting large chand. but this one was a lot bigger than I assumed. I normally install metal pan boxes for chand. but they all mount with a strap. I understand that the stud is used to support the chand. by the building structure instead of the box. Is there a special type box that can have a strap or stud/hickey mount. What type of box/setup should I use if I know during rough in that the box will mount with stud/hickey? Lack of experience is costing me. Any help will be appreciated.
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You could also use a paddle fan box, they make a variety of types, for different installations.:D
 
lowryder88h said:
You could also use a paddle fan box, they make a variety of types, for different installations.:D
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IMG_1545.jpg
IMG_1546.jpg

IMG_1520.jpg

Something tells me that your paddle fan box will not hold this fixture. over 350 lbs and all leaded crystal glass, 468 parts. took us 16 hrs to assemble and hang.
 
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bikeindy said:
Something tells me that your paddle fan box will not hold this fixture. over 350 lbs and all leaded crystal glass, 468 parts. took us 16 hrs to assemble and hang.
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That kind of installation just begs for a winch system.
 
Most ceilings are designed for not more than 20 pounds per square foot. If I had a 350 pound chandalier to hang, I would be using doubled 2x4s on edge spanning two joists or truss chords on each side of the support point, and I would be using an eye-bolt or steel cable through the box to support it. The box would not be part of the support sustem.
 
LarryFine said:
That kind of installation just begs for a winch system.
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The cutomer actually asked for one to be installed. When I gave her the price she told me sh would just reach over the railing to change the bulbs and clean it. Well that is not likely to happen. We mounted in such a way that we will be able to install a winch at a later date if she requests it.
 
Bob NH said:
Most ceilings are designed for not more than 20 pounds per square foot. If I had a 350 pound chandalier to hang, I would be using doubled 2x4s on edge spanning two joists or truss chords on each side of the support point, and I would be using an eye-bolt or steel cable through the box to support it. The box would not be part of the support sustem.
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I wish I had pics of the attic space. I had a carpenter come in and take care of the support framing That fixture is not hanging from a joist. The fixture hangs from chain which travels through a pully and has a tie down point the fixture chain is attached to that chain. and you are correct that the box is in no way part of the support of the fixture.
 
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With regard to the OP, I've had a few lightweight (maybe 20 lb or so) fixtures in the past few years that are coming with the hickey. Might be what you have. I've just purchased a standard threaded strap or bar or whatever you want to call it and a locknut and tossed out the hickey.
 
j_erickson said:
I've just purchased a standard threaded strap or bar or whatever you want to call it and a locknut and tossed out the hickey.
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The last really heavy fixture we hung was over 100 lbs. I used doubled-up fixture straps (bars?) with doubled-up nuts on top, and four 1/4" x 4" lag screws through the pancake box and into the framing.

For the next-to heaviest one (around 75 lbs), I used a fan brace and two straps again, but this time I used both the 10-24 and 8-32 bolt holes with the two straps in an X. It was more than plenty sturdy.

By the way, always drill pilot holes for screws or lags into wood. You'll get better support because the wood won't split along the grain. It's important to use the proper size bit: the screw 's minor diameter, or a hair smaller.
 
I have another method for big fixtures. 1/2" RMC through the center KO as the old gas lighting used to be hung - that goes though framing and steel washers with a coupling on the other side. The coupling gets drilled and tapped for a set screw to keep it from coming loose. And through the RMC nipple put a safety cable in. Some larger ones I have used 1/2" threaded rod...

Bottom line about learning the hard way is to demand a fixture spec and weight as soon as the word 'Chandelier' is used. And if working to hang sconces of certain types of Art Deco or simularly scaled building ask about sconces too. I once showed up to a job site to install 'sconces' and was shown two pallets wieghing 400 lbs ea. of architectual cast iron.
 
e57 said:
I once showed up to a job site to install 'sconces' and was shown two pallets wieghing 400 lbs ea. of architectual cast iron.
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I hope you hadn't priced the job yet. :roll:
 
Type of box

That chandelier is cryin' for an "Alladin Light Lift".Enlighten the h/owner as to the cost of a service call to replace bulbs which they won't be able to get to themselves the math does the rest for you. Approximately 10 service calls =1 light lift .If they can afford that chandelier they should be able to go for the light lift.If that doesn't convince them show them a before and after picture-after being after the house cleaner spun the fixture backwards a few times to clean the bulbs before the last family gathering[when they almost lost aunt flo to a falling chandelier.]
 
LarryFine said:
That kind of installation just begs for a winch system.
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I did one of those a few years ago using the Alladin light lift system, they do come in different weight categories.The one we installed was the 750 lb. class.Guess what it failed and the cable snapped.It took out a mosaic tile pattern on the floor and also almost took out the tile installers.Lucky they had just gone to lunch.

The larger high line fixtures usually come with a thick metal mounting bar and pipe hickey mount.I prefer on rough in when you know there will be a HUGE chandelier installed to simply attach a 2 X 6 above the trusses and set 1/4 20 all thread from there, through a metal box and leave it extend beyond the box.A few fender washers and hex nuts on both ends and on fixture install . Just cut to length remove the lower hex nuts install the bar and reattach the washers and nuts.

Oh that light lift failure was not the only one I have heard of.
 
Does anyone have a link the these "lift systems" - I'm curious what they look like, and how much they cost.

BikeIndy - those chandeliers are impressive. Looks like you do quite a few high-end homes. Nice!

Thanks

Brett
 
Just a side thought. I prefer the Wilshire lift to the Aladdin. It's a little more money, but a better product and easier to install.
 
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