Used as a Neutral.....

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kwired said:
Some of us work in places where the supply house is 100+ miles away and you do what you have to do until you can come back with correct parts.
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That doesn't seem like the case in this scenario.

JAP>
 
And this brings us to outfitting your truck stock; I still have 2 add a lugs in my service kit.
 
LarryFine said:
Welcome to the forum, Erika!


Actually, that's Providing the Neutral. You're talking about the grounding electrode conductor(s).


The neutral path, not the ground path. The neutral current pathway must be a conductor or bus, not an enclosure or fittings.


There should be no grounding conductor from the meter to the main disconnect.


There should only be one intentional connection between the neutral and each of the grounding-electrode and the equipment-grounding systems, not "multiple attempts" at grounding it.

It's more accurate to say that the premises equipment grounding system begins where the neutral is bonded to and earthed. The service equipment is directly bonded to the supply neutral up to that point.


Nothing personal, it's just that we're sticklers for accuracy here. We've even had long discussions about having long discussions. It seems the simpler the question, the more complicated the answer.
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Thank You Larry,
Thank you for being a stickler for accuracy... Excellent that you cleared that up. Maybe that's why I wrote a long answer... :ashamed1: At least that's the story I'm sticking to. Plus it was my first post. I've been refreshing my knowledge base.

Sincerely,
Erika.
 
sameguy said:
And this brings us to outfitting your truck stock; I still have 2 add a lugs in my service kit.
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Isn't something normally needed for a service call. Initial installations/add oin installations, yes. I have a few of them in the shop but probably not a single one on truck. Can't remember last time I needed one either.
 
GizmoGirl said:
. . . I've been refreshing my knowledge base.

Sincerely,
Erika.
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I'll second the Welcome.

Don't shy away from posting. And keep Article 100 Definitions handy, as the use of the terms in correct context will further the conversation.

I well remember my first posts and the learning curve that accompanied them. It is exceedingly worth the effort! A truly efficient "refresher."
 
al hildenbrand said:
I'll second the Welcome.

Don't shy away from posting. And keep Article 100 Definitions handy, as the use of the terms in correct context will further the conversation.

I well remember my first posts and the learning curve that accompanied them. It is exceedingly worth the effort! A truly efficient "refresher."
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Good Morning Al up north...

It's all good. I will... Thank You.

Between engineering with several controls companies along my diverse career a friend suggested I work residential with them, so I did. The Inspectors complemented my panel work as Neat and Organized. Wish I could keep all my own jazz neat and organized.

I found this forum a couple years back and it has been great. I finally got brave enough to post something. I've been doing a lot of study again, intermixed with my own projects. One never knows when I might need to pick up my clipboard and do some estimating, or maybe run away and join the Circus... What should I do when I grow up? ;)

GizmoGirl
 
GizmoGirl said:
Good Morning Al up north...

It's all good. I will... Thank You.

Between engineering with several controls companies along my diverse career a friend suggested I work residential with them, so I did. The Inspectors complemented my panel work as Neat and Organized. Wish I could keep all my own jazz neat and organized.

I found this forum a couple years back and it has been great. I finally got brave enough to post something. I've been doing a lot of study again, intermixed with my own projects. One never knows when I might need to pick up my clipboard and do some estimating, or maybe run away and join the Circus... What should I do when I grow up? ;)

GizmoGirl
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There are people past 50 that still ask that question.
 
Like some of us just be an Electrician until you find something better to do; for me it was retirement and getting to say no to anyone requesting me to actually use more than my brain.
 
➡️temp fixes can become permanent

➡️temp fixes can become permanent

1793 said:
I confronted the EC today and he said that was a temporary solution until he could get the appropriate lug to mount onto the main panel neutral bar.

Thanks to all who have posted. :):):)
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I had one urgent nighttime call where I bypassed a freq drive to enable a 50horse 480pump for 1M gal swim pool for a swim meet, disco within sight.

???...24/7?
I told him, replace the freq

11 years later? I came back and that pump was still 24/7
no control, no freq... 24/7/365/11$

pool was pretty clean

➡️temp fixes can become permanent
 
wyreman said:
I had one urgent nighttime call where I bypassed a freq drive to enable a 50horse 480pump for 1M gal swim pool for a swim meet, disco within sight.

������������������...24/7������
I told him, replace the freq

11 years later������ I came back and that pump was still 24/7
no control, no freq... 24/7/365/11$

pool was pretty clean

➡️temp fixes can become permanent
Click to expand...

I'll be going back in no time to look at the final for the basement remodel. It WILL be corrected timely!!!
 
wyreman said:
I had one urgent nighttime call where I bypassed a freq drive to enable a 50horse 480pump for 1M gal swim pool for a swim meet, disco within sight.

������������������...24/7������
I told him, replace the freq

11 years later������ I came back and that pump was still 24/7
no control, no freq... 24/7/365/11$

pool was pretty clean

➡️temp fixes can become permanent
Click to expand...
What is the reason to vary speed on such a setup? Is there a reason to have more flow at some times? If not then why not get the right size pump instead of a drive for an oversized pump?
 
When you have that much water in that big of a pipe, they want to start stirring the water softly, not to bang in on across the line.
As the water gets moving, they ramp up the Hz
Also, once the water is flowing, it only needs a nudge to keep it going.
And there is need for more flow when there is more "organic load"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YDurhx8QyA
Screen Shot 2019-02-24 at 9.40.54 PM.jpg
This is all tied to control systems
 
wyreman said:
When you have that much water in that big of a pipe, they want to start stirring the water softly, not to bang in on across the line.
As the water gets moving, they ramp up the Hz
Also, once the water is flowing, it only needs a nudge to keep it going.
And there is need for more flow when there is more "organic load"
This is all tied to control systems
Click to expand...

Controls... VFD's, Pumps, Valves, Big blowers and everything that can go wrong. One of the office towers I did back in the day had a pair of very expensive latest technology VFD's to control a pair of 150HP blowers in an elevator penthouse.

We used DDC to vary the speeds of those drives to provide the proper building pressures. Well that all changes when there's a fire... Or certification test. Return air dampers close, and a smaller 40 HP blower with smoke damper opens, and goes to full speed to vent building's ducts... The building has to clear in X Many minutes to pass its certification.

WELLL... We had the timing wrong on the RETURN AIR DAMPER "WALL..." and the opening and full speed on the Fire Vent system during the first cert test... This damper was huge 36' across and 15' high. The pressure built so quickly behind that thing it busted all the welds, bent things up and pushed the whole caboodle 1 foot from where it was supposed to be... No problem Blame the controls contractor...

Yeah with pumps especially huge flows and big pipe sizes a WATER HAMMER situation can exponentially increase pressure. I'm sure they ramped the water speed down also along with up... If you hear the thump when your washing machine valve closes, Imagine what you could do with a BIG Pipe... BOOM. Not replacing that VFD not good. Not just a waste of energy... A power failure situation could be bad.

Erika
 
wyreman said:
When you have that much water in that big of a pipe, they want to start stirring the water softly, not to bang in on across the line.
As the water gets moving, they ramp up the Hz
Also, once the water is flowing, it only needs a nudge to keep it going.
And there is need for more flow when there is more "organic load"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1YDurhx8QyA
View attachment 22409
This is all tied to control systems
Click to expand...
If there is a need for more flow at times that is understandable. If it only starts one time, stays at one speed then runs 24/7 for extended time afterward, one may just decide to live with the surge on the line when it starts, really depends on if it is likely to damage anything.
 
wyreman said:
I had one urgent nighttime call where I bypassed a freq drive to enable a 50horse 480pump for 1M gal swim pool for a swim meet, disco within sight.

???...24/7?
I told him, replace the freq

11 years later? I came back and that pump was still 24/7
no control, no freq... 24/7/365/11$

pool was pretty clean

➡️temp fixes can become permanent
Click to expand...

Temporary fixes can become permanent problems that is.

If they're now simply closing a disconnect to start the motor, I'd find it hard to call bypassing all of a motor's overcurrent protection a "Fix".

In this scenario also, standard size 3 motor starters aren't that hard to come by, and should have been changed out soon after the meet.

JAP>
 
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