Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

[ronaldrc]

I am currently wiring a modular home the service is a 200 amp. with meter base main disc. with four extra circuits outside.

I am sub feeding a 100 amp. sub panel for their barn out of this outside panel.

They want a threeway light switch from the barn to house.

Unfortunately they don't have a barb wire fence.

So does anyone see a code violation in using the 100 amp. sub feed neutral for the neutral for this threeway light at the barn in other words pick the neutral up at the barn panel? I will be pulling two #12 thwn copper wires with my #2 alum service conductor in my 1-1/2" conduit.This will be the travelers the switch feed will be from a 20 single pole breaker at the house.

Thanks for any response:Ronald

 

[jimwalker]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

It could result in the 100 amp panel getting a few more amps than it can carry if the neutral was already fully loaded.If we are talking about a 100 watts or something i cant really see it causing a problem.But it is using a hot from one panel and neutral from another and is a violation

 

[petersonra]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

Originally posted by jimwalker:
But it is using a hot from one panel and neutral from another and is a violation

is that what he is really doing? The feeder out to the outbuilding is just a branch circuit. The neutral going out there is the same neutral. nothing prevents you from using the same nuetral for multiple branchs as long as it is sized for it.

now if it was a seperate system, I would object.

 

[ronaldrc]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

Thanks for response

Jim,I'm not really using the neutral of another panel just the other end of the 100 amp neutral.

Just kidding I agree with both of you with no more load than a couple amps. I don't see how it would be a problem. And it is the same system.

There should be no problem with fields because the traveler and the neutral are together.

 

[jimwalker]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

bit confused.You said the feed would be from the house.Lets think this out.Should the wire to the barn get cut in half i now have a panel that thru the light fixture is hot on the neutral.Now if anyone touches any metal boxes or the panel he just got fried.I know its unlikely but things do happen .If the distance is not too far i would suggest a motion detector at either or both ends

 

[ronaldrc]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

What a stretch

But its a four wire system the neutral is floating.
Another plus for a four wire system huh?

[ January 06, 2005, 06:56 PM: Message edited by: ronaldrc ]

 

[russ]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

To get past 210.4 both the 100 amp breaker and the 15/20 amp breaker have to be in the same panel.
There isn't enough information to see if it complies with 210.4(C)

 

[ronaldrc]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

Russ all my circuits are from the main 200 amp. panel with the meterbase. The 42 circuit main distribution panel on the inside of the modular home is just a buss extension ask Roger.

Right Roger?

 

[russ]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

Some how I get the feeling this is a done deal no matter what.

 

[ronaldrc]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

Russ you could be right,would you pull a separate #12 neutral?

If I run three #12s I will just go ahead and feed it from the barn.Hot from barn to house and two travelers coming back to barn.


I will probably do it that way.

Ronald

[ January 06, 2005, 07:30 PM: Message edited by: ronaldrc ]

 

[hbiss]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

But it is using a hot from one panel and neutral from another and is a violation-
...is that what he is really doing?

Sure looks that way to me. Why don't you just pull another #12 and do it right?

-Hal

 

[roger]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

Originally posted by ronaldrc:
Russ all my circuits are from the main 200 amp. panel with the meterbase. The 42 circuit main distribution panel on the inside of the modular home is just a buss extension ask Roger.

Right Roger?

Hello Ronald my friend.

Roger

 

[russ]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

I almost for got does this funky multi wire circuit only feed line to neutral loads. nothing 240V in the barn? Nothing 240V on the bus extention thingamigig thing?

 

[ronaldrc]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

No no Russ,the buss extension is that thingamagig distribution panel in the house since the real main breaker is on the outside Roger myself and a few others started calling the main distribution panel a buss extension.

Hello Roger hope your having a great new year.

 

[jimwalker]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

It is using 2 panels even if same bussbar.Yes it will work fine but is it worth the risk?You could also pull your neutral from your next door neighbors house but i dont suggest it.There are many things that will work but violate codes.Could your doing this also be violating another code in that you now have more than one service to that barn ?Just how much distance are we talking here ? an extra run of #12 would cost what ? Somehow i think this job is already installed.Like i said it will probably be ok.We do live in a sue happy world so be carefull even if its your own home you might sell later.

 

[ronaldrc]

Re: Using service neutral as a branch cir. neutral?

Jim honestly the job has not been done and I will pull 3 #12s and make it hot from the barn panel.

The total length of the conductors are 158 ft. one way.

The only load in the barn will be only lighting and maybe a 1500 watt heater.It is really a small Bldg. with one small room for the panel and four horse stalls.

It will be ok to use the same equipment ground want it?

Ronald